1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

The VW Beetle. Everything about bugs!
Ol'fogasaurus
Posts: 17756
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2006 10:17 pm

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by Ol'fogasaurus »

rrb6699 wrote: Wed Mar 28, 2018 7:25 pm ... I just changed plugs & wires, but, didn't gap the plugs as I thought the factory had set them. ... the bug runs great after I get into 2nd gear....
Best advice: Don't assume!

The thing about getting into second gear is confusing to say the least. Have you checked the carb float for level set correctly or being clean (look at the filter also).

Check for loose wires and do you have/need a dropping resistor assuming you haven't converted to an electrical conversion of some types some of coils require them while others don't but I kind of don't think this is it for some reason. With all the different styles of electrical connections now days I would be looking at them also.

What distributor are you running as there are several types with some being better than others.
User avatar
rrb6699
Posts: 304
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:49 pm

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by rrb6699 »

Yes, it's a Pertonix conversion. The Pertonix seems to be in need of replacement. When I drive for 30 minutes or longer especially on hot days I have to wait up to an hour before the car will start again if I turn it off. Any recommendations on a good replacement for the Protonix or should I just get the same ignition module?

actually, the car stopped the minor backfiring and does it much less after a week on the new plug set & wires.

Also, In the picture I attached there's a tube below the oil fill cap. And it looks to be corresponding tothe same size tube protruding out of the fan shroud. Should there be a hose connecting those two? If so, would that help cool the oil by injecting air from the fan shroud to that tube below the fill cap?

Also there's an eight pass oil cooler installed behind the fan shroud on the left side. As you can see from the over view picture of the engine there's a K & N filter on the left side. I don't know if both coolers are still active since this was on the car when I got it or if the other one was disabled.

the car is a 2bbl Weber 32/36 DFAV 23A E6. I'm ordering a car kit with float for it soon.

well, looking to find fixes to these issues and more...
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
RR

1972 Restoration Project.
User avatar
Piledriver
Moderator
Posts: 22520
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 12:01 am

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by Piledriver »

2bbl Weber 32/36 DFAV
Ah........ :cry:
1: Slide a sheet of hard plastic between the choke electrical connection and the fan housing.
Glue it in place.

Do your heat risers get hot?

Just buy a compufire.
In my experience they work as well or better, and are a bit more reliable.

Note I long ago abandoned carbs and distributors, so my experience with them isn't recent..
Addendum to Newtons first law:
zero vehicles on jackstands, square gets a fresh 090 and 1911, cabby gets a blower.
EZ3.6 Vanagon after that.(mounted, needs everything finished) then Creamsicle.
User avatar
rrb6699
Posts: 304
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:49 pm

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by rrb6699 »

still hanging on to a carb here. i'll look into the Compufire. anyone know about the hose I mentioned?

sorry but what heat risers? still a newbie - intermediate on bugs.
RR

1972 Restoration Project.
User avatar
SCOTTRODS
Posts: 625
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 7:15 am

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by SCOTTRODS »

If you connect the tube from the oil fill to the shroud, you will pretty much blow all the oil out of the rear pulley area (unless you have a sand seal installed, and maybe even still it would) The two tubes are supposed to be separate systems, one to allow oil vapor from the crank case to be sucked up and burned in the combustion process,
Image

the one on the shroud is part of the emissions stuff I believe. I don't currently have one with the shroud connection... but I believe it was started with the Charcoal cannister to the fuel tank system... I could be wrong. I know older ones are sans extra shroud hose connector. Could even be part of the fuel injection hook ups...
I have found them completely missing more than once. - PILEDRIVER

Some pics of My Powder Coating work
http://s244.photobucket.com/albums/gg6/terrellster/
My Facebook Page for Powder Coating
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001788886297
User avatar
Piledriver
Moderator
Posts: 22520
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 12:01 am

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by Piledriver »

On the progressive carb the power connection for the choke will be hard against the fan housing and will very likely provide intermittent shorts to the fan housing. This causes cut outs.
That wire also powers the coil, and backup light circuit, although that section had an inline fuse from the factory..
It is usually unfused and krispy.
Addendum to Newtons first law:
zero vehicles on jackstands, square gets a fresh 090 and 1911, cabby gets a blower.
EZ3.6 Vanagon after that.(mounted, needs everything finished) then Creamsicle.
User avatar
rrb6699
Posts: 304
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:49 pm

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by rrb6699 »

The auto makers and the auto parts makers never design things to fail. Why would you want something to fail?

.
.
.
I wasn't suggesting that I'd want something to fail. but, adsif I had a choice, i'd rather have the threads on the plug fail before the engine block threads.

I know it's not that way, but, just sayin...
RR

1972 Restoration Project.
User avatar
rrb6699
Posts: 304
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:49 pm

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by rrb6699 »

I see the power connection to the choke, but, it looks like it won't make contact. I may cover it with liquid electrical tape just in case
RR

1972 Restoration Project.
Ol'fogasaurus
Posts: 17756
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2006 10:17 pm

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by Ol'fogasaurus »

#1: Do a capacitance check on #2 wire. If it doesn't peg the needle to the other side I would replace it.

#2 Check the seal and electrode on the spark plug as they are known to fail. https://www.bing.com/search?q=how+do+yo ... 48d1b61490

#3 Do a compression check.

#4 Check the cap and rotor. Caps do crack and dist shafts and bearings can have problems.

Very few things are designed to fail and the interface between plugs vs. heads are not one of the few things.
User avatar
rrb6699
Posts: 304
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:49 pm

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by rrb6699 »

I'm just curious if I should use either hose connection. i'd like to know what the one on the shroud is for.

the oil tube can't be connected to my air cleaner but, I'll have to look again to see if there's any hose connection on it.

refer to my Apr 02 post pics.

if not, should I plug either of them?

rr
RR

1972 Restoration Project.
User avatar
SCOTTRODS
Posts: 625
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 7:15 am

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by SCOTTRODS »

Under your right rear fender, there should be a charcoal canister that is kind of shaped like a coffee can that's been flattened somewhat. if it's there, The one from the fan shroud goes to that. If the fuel system in your car is correct I believe it will have one. If not, then you're gonna find yourself looking for more parts the car is missing. I have heard of a lot of folks building their own charcoal evaporated box, or taking the one that is there apart to rejuvenate it. You can buy the charcoal media that goes into it fairly cheap if I remember right (I think it's just typical activated charcoal media). There should be a thin (14" or so) line that goes from the charcoal canister to the front of the car to connect to the plastic tube that should be mounted under the hood, across the area just Dash side of the hood opening (We'll call it behind the hood and under the cowling). That long tub is often times crimped but by high centering on the passenger side, as I believe it is an aluminum tube, but can't remember if it is or not. sometimes it's just missing due to Previous owner *adjustment*. The way it works is the fan provides a little pressure to the charcoal canister, which transfers the pressure via the long tube, up to the white plastic tube bit under the cowling area... where it is allowed some form of ventilation and a small amount of the pressure is provided to the Gas tank to keep vapor locking and tank vacuum from forming. the tube at the cowl also keeps the fumes from the tank from getting out of the tank and into the passenger area and under the hood, I don't know what to call it, but balance tube or separator would make some sense. Maybe even expansion tube... I don't know. I'mnot even entirely exactly sure all of this is how it works, but somehow through all of this, it was a requirement to keep the cars selling in the US after I believe 70 or 71... and I'm even less sure about the year than about the "evaporation" system described above. But I have removed a lot of damaged ones and run several cars without them. There will be a smell of fuel in hot weather a lot of the time if you eliminate the system, unless you can come up with something better... You can strata the search for proper items by opening the "trunk" and looking at the filler neck of the fuel tank and see if there are any tubes besides an overflow tube (About the size of your finger or thumb). the tubes you are looking for, for the system, is very small like 3-5 mm id stuff and just really flimsy light weight stuff that looks like vacuum tube.
I have found them completely missing more than once. - PILEDRIVER

Some pics of My Powder Coating work
http://s244.photobucket.com/albums/gg6/terrellster/
My Facebook Page for Powder Coating
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001788886297
User avatar
rrb6699
Posts: 304
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:49 pm

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by rrb6699 »

OK. I've got all this. I finally understand how that all works. I just didn't see how that thin tube did anything without pressure. I will hook that all up.

thanks!
RR

1972 Restoration Project.
ainokea
Posts: 182
Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 5:27 pm

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by ainokea »

I would think some thought would have given to a little anti seize on any plugs that are installed in aluminum or cast iron heads. In many cases plugs are cross threaded on installation so anti seize won't help. Then there are plugs installed and not changed or replaced at recommended intervals. They may rust up and removing them removes the plug hole thread at the same time. Even Bosch plugs are susceptible to rust if not replaced at recommended intervals. But a light coating of anti seize when changing plugs helps in removing plugs without removing the head threads.
ainokea
Posts: 182
Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 5:27 pm

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by ainokea »

The quality of Bosch plugs is not what it used to be because they are not all made in Germany anymore. I have had misfire problems with Bosch resistor plugs that were solved by going with 1/2 in. NGK B6HS non resistor spark plugs. The VW plug wires have 1,000 ohms resistance built into the plug connectors, the rotor has resistance built in also. Now the spark plugs have built in resistors. Something has to give with all this resistance and must contribute to engine misfiring. Just my own thoughts on mysterious misfiring.
P_Vilefort
Posts: 30
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2022 12:41 am

Re: 1972 Beetle - recommended plugs and wire set

Post by P_Vilefort »

rrb6699
The picture you posted with the aluminized heater hoses: the right hand hose is connected to the intake air preheat. It is supposed to be connected to the right hand heating box air inlet.
Where is the vacuum advance diaphragm on the Pertronix distributor? Pertronix distributors come with a vacuum advance-retard diaphragm that is seen on the left rear of the distributor. This looks like a 009 distributor with maybe a Pertronix unit inside. Those 009 distributors were intended for a bus or Type 2 model that was used for stop and go delivery service, not for over-the-road operation. The crankcase vent hose is not connected and the hoses for the fuel tank venting are no longer in place. Is the charcoals canister still under the right rear fender?
Use resistor wires not resistor plugs.
The connection on the shroud is for pressurized air for the charcoal canister that should be under the rear right hand fender. Canister holds fumes from Fuel tank. If you have the original sized tires a round charcoal canister from a newer car can work. You can also put a round canister in the same location but over the transmission. The Type 181 VW (Thing) also had the same identical canister as the Beetle and Super Beetle. Take a look at page 18 in the Fuel System section of the Bentley Manual..
Post Reply