Axle clips

[Leatherneck]

Who runs axle clips on the ends of the CV's? Both, inner or outer?
Why?

[Marc]

Circletrack cars don't use much suspension travel (provided they're kept shiny-side-up) but to allow a little extra tolerance for a diagonal arm getting bent from wheel-to-wheel or wheel-to-wall contact I'd leave the clip off the inboard end and the Belleville washer off the outer end. Leaving the opposite components off makes it easier for the axle to poke a hole in the final drive cap. I figured that was the best compromise since the objective is to allow finishing with a wounded car, and if they see that you're dropping oil you'll be flagged off.

[CentralWAbaja]

I have to run them or the axles would fall out of the stars at full droop. In fact I had to machine the stars a little to get the last inch of travel or so out of my axles.

[Leatherneck]

I have to run them or the axles would fall out of the stars at full droop. In fact I had to machine the stars a little to get the last inch of travel or so out of my axles.

I need to get a couple more clips, had my axle fall out of the star. Need to set limit straps again too.

[Ol'fogasaurus]

Or longer axles!

[CentralWAbaja]

Or longer axles!

That's not the answer at all. Not sure if that was sarcasm or suggestion. The axles can only be so long mid stroke before binding in the drive flanges. I will have to dig up the pics of the modification I had to do to the stars on mine.

[Ol'fogasaurus]

It was more sarcasm/joke CWB.

I was advised many years ago, when I first got into off-road VWs, that the C-clips should be used for a couple of reasons:

One was to limit the axles sliding back and forth hammering the trans output shaft and the stub axle end.

Also so the splines would not jam into the star part of the CVs and stick or cause the star to tip inside of the CV and cause nasty things to happen. At the neutral position of the suspension travel there should be some "wiggle room" of the axle and at compression (especially) and full hang there should be full spline in the star part of the CV.

I know a lot of off-road people push the full compression/full hang axle length a bit; I am assuming that they are probably doing it as a calculated "coin toss" knowing (or not) what they could be getting themselves into. When using stock, in-modified, trailing arms there is the potential of some flex side to side which, so when pushing your luck on the axle end being inside of the star the potential of jamming the CVs is possible. I don't remember seeing it done by the guys I know but I have heard of it happening.

With modified arms the potential of a odd type of landing is still there due somewhat in part to the pivot of the trailing arm (not all pivots are as strong as people think they are). I often wonder why a true IRS suspension isn't done which would get away from one of the two arcs that we have to deal with. Weight/mass is probably one of the big factors in not doing it.

On Spikes Xtreme 4x4 not too long ago, "Whats his face" (no insult intended as I just can't remember his name as I write) was talking about the long travel rear sway bar: the same as or similar to the one that Dan (http://www.dansperformanceparts.com/sand.html [I didn't see that it was being shown here or in the rear suspension part]) was talking about years ago. At the time Dan was talking about it I hadn't see pix of it until he posted the pix then it did make sense to me.

My reply was not meant as fact but saying that there are many parts to the proper answer.

[CentralWAbaja]

here you go guys



This allowed me to have the proper slack at the mid-point as to not have binding and then still get to the max travel I was seeking.

FWIW this is not a concept I came up with on my own, but advise from what I consider to be one of the best builders of off road race cars in the business.

[CentralWAbaja]

wow that was a big picture! Or maybe its just displaying big on my computer LOL

[Leatherneck]

Oh, ok so if I am seeing this right then you machined out the star. I would of thought to go longer on the axle splines, Good idea.

[CentralWAbaja]

Oh, ok so if I am seeing this right then you machined out the star. I would of thought to go longer on the axle splines, Good idea.

My axle lengths are set with 3/8" slop at the mid point with the stub flange and trans flange sitting level with one another.

Stars are machined .188 deep on each one. I am limit strapped at where it was maxed so with stretch I am still safe from pulling the stars apart. It's not that I am actually using that extra gained by the machining but I am using everything that was there prior vs coming up short.... if that makes sense?

[Leatherneck]

Oh, ok so if I am seeing this right then you machined out the star. I would of thought to go longer on the axle splines, Good idea.

My axle lengths are set with 3/8" slop at the mid point with the stub flange and trans flange sitting level with one another.

Stars are machined .188 deep on each one. I am limit strapped at where it was maxed so with stretch I am still safe from pulling the stars apart. It's not that I am actually using that extra gained by the machining but I am using everything that was there prior vs coming up short.... if that makes sense?

It does, using all available travel without worrying about busting a part. Thanks!

[Ol'fogasaurus]

CWB, to state the obvious question,,, the relief is in the C-clip side of the CV star? It makes a lot of sense that way at least to me. How did you determine the depth of the relief? Do you know a max depth limit to the relief?

Thanks for posting that, I don't think I would have thought of that fix but it seems to be so simple of a safe fix.

[CentralWAbaja]

Yes the relief is to let the clip slide down inside the bore of the star. Again this was advise from a source that builds race winning cars and trucks and has way more experience in doing so then anybody I have come in contact with since my interest in this hobby began.

The .188 depth was also his call. He helped me set up my axle length and sold me my axles. I do not know how much you could push that .188 number before you start to give up the strength of the spline of the star. I suppose a lot would depend on how much power is being transferred through the CV's

[Ol'fogasaurus]

You pushed the right buttons on your answer . Thanks.

One thing I wish we had would be a single source/collection of information/tips or a dictionary of ideas like this when they come up (I didn't use the word "trivia" as in this case it really doesn't fit as "trivia"... its important! Leather built the off-road build list which sure helps with tracking down some info assuming you know who the info was from but there is so much info like this hidden away in the rhetoric on other things. Sometimes you don't know you might need it in the future so you don't put it to memory but when the need comes up you may not be able to recall that you read it before or... if you do then where and when.

Lee