1969 el-cheapo 1600 turbo

[joosep84]

I bought my car few years ago without an engine. I had no experience with aircooled engines at all. My first idea was clean the floor, remove the rust and just paint it but it was so thin that light came threw. I started to look used engine parts to build an engine....I collected 3 1200-1600 engines but it was all junk. Then I got almoust complete 1600 with new pistons and barrels. It was gread find. I put that together and installed a turbo and megasquirt.




















It´s all stock inside the engine. it´s not eaven balanced. I boosted it up to 1BAR (1 Bar = 14,5 PSI I think) Without first gear it made 14,9 (I started with 2nd gear and 5000rpm I shifted 6-6300 rpm) Top speed was 155km/h 60 feet was 2,2


few weeks later I changed the turbo because last one died with bad oil and +30C air temp on last race. New one was a-bit bigger. Before the race I tested it with 1 and 2 gear about 20-30 times with 1,7 BAR pressure. It moved deam good. I never could use third or fourth gear. On the race I started easily with low rpm and without boost 2,2s 60 feet. with 1 and 2 gear it moved like 20-30 times before.....it was good. but with third gear boost went up (Over 30 PSI because of my mistake and it couldn´t give a spark....it didnt move at all with 3 and 4 gear...I released the pedal and it rolled over the finiš line.....top speed was 5km/h lower but time was 13,9 I made 1 more run but boost was deam high and piston was broken.

next year I´m going to try once mor how strong are the stock parts and grow boost step by step. If i repair brakes I can make the burnout too
What do you think what time can I catch?

[yvre]

I think the car is ugly but 13.9 is damn good for a 1600cc ...

[fastback]

cool
we like
cheap'O!

[joosep84]

I know that it´s ugly. All go no show at the time. At the moment I´m welding the back, removing the stuff from hood and so on. I hope to paint it for spring.

13,9 came with 2,2 60 feet and it didn´t move with 3 and 4th at all. So I´m planing 12 for next year with all stock inside the engine...eaven stock crank goes over 6000 and stock pistons can handle 25 PSI if all is OK

I´m going to replace the pistons and bearings and 8 dowel the stock crank

[1938vw]

Well done! I've been following your posts on here for a while. Considering how hard it is for you to get parts this is even more of an achievement!

[joosep84]

I´m just want to know how fast I can go with stock parts.
I could buy a china crank or forged pistons. It´s not hard....just pay 2-3 times more and wait 2-3 weeks. But I don´t want to waste money because engine have to build in once and I know what I want but can´t afford it at the moment.
My plans fore future:
go afford with stock engine and little money until I can afford 2,2-2,4L stroker with good parts. Then I need better trans too.
At the moment I´m looking for stock trans. I have 2 extra already...when I broke one then I just have to change it. (takes 1,5 hour) I like stock trans because it´s enouh for 1600. It gives about 170 km/h with 6000rpm with my old slicks and that´s enough for next year I think.

[jweir]

I would replace the stock rod bolts with some better bolts like ARP or something else heavy duty. 8 dowel the crank and have it wedgemated if you're going to be dumping the clutch at 5k rpm for drag racing. Tearing the flywheel from the crankshaft really sucks. Get some forged pistons and a bigger cam and turbo. Drop your compression to something like 7:1 if you're at sea level. There's a turbo 1641cc ( 87mm vs 85.5mm pistons) somewhere on this site that is making well over 200hp and it also has nitrous. Running 20 something pounds of boost. Stock crank and rods. If you're getting forged pistons, go with a set of 94mm and have the machine work done for the larger pistons. I've seen some 1914cc's make 230-250hp on stock crank and rods.

[1938vw]

There's a turbo 1641cc ( 87mm vs 85.5mm pistons) somewhere on this site that is making well over 200hp and it also has nitrous.

Is that "hyper bug"?

[joosep84]

I would replace the stock rod bolts with some better bolts like ARP or something else heavy duty. 8 dowel the crank and have it wedgemated if you're going to be dumping the clutch at 5k rpm for drag racing. Tearing the flywheel from the crankshaft really sucks. Get some forged pistons and a bigger cam and turbo. Drop your compression to something like 7:1 if you're at sea level. There's a turbo 1641cc ( 87mm vs 85.5mm pistons) somewhere on this site that is making well over 200hp and it also has nitrous. Running 20 something pounds of boost. Stock crank and rods. If you're getting forged pistons, go with a set of 94mm and have the machine work done for the larger pistons. I've seen some 1914cc's make 230-250hp on stock crank and rods.

Thank you for suggestions
Have you seen broken rod bolts? It would be good to know how far the originals can go.
Crank will be 8 doweled in this week. Dou you have any videos of wedgemating? Sorry but I don´t know what that is....maybe because of language barrier I´m shifting near 6300RPM from 2´nd to 3´d with full throttle and 16-18 PSi What cam would be better than original for 1600 turbo? I´m holding it all stock because I want to know how fast could it be. I´m keeping it cheap because I hope to start building another engine with bigger displacement about 2011 or 2012.
static compression ratio is around 8:1

What would be needed for 1914......it´s easyer to say what can be stock?
I have to buy new pistons anyway....what would be the CR with stock crank and rods.
Cause it´s bigger displacement I need another cam and headwork...

Deem now it´s hard to build 1600 when I know that somebody has 250hp with 1914 and with stock crank and rods... I´ve heard that thouse A pistons can be used with UP to 78mm crank I´m thinking that when I buy 94 pistons this year and crank next year I could build it up to 2165.

[jweir]

Thank you for suggestions
Have you seen broken rod bolts? It would be good to know how far the originals can go.
Crank will be 8 doweled in this week. Dou you have any videos of wedgemating? Sorry but I don´t know what that is....maybe because of language barrier I´m shifting near 6300RPM from 2´nd to 3´d with full throttle and 16-18 PSi What cam would be better than original for 1600 turbo? I´m holding it all stock because I want to know how fast could it be. I´m keeping it cheap because I hope to start building another engine with bigger displacement about 2011 or 2012.
static compression ratio is around 8:1

What would be needed for 1914......it´s easyer to say what can be stock?
I have to buy new pistons anyway....what would be the CR with stock crank and rods.
Cause it´s bigger displacement I need another cam and headwork...

Deem now it´s hard to build 1600 when I know that somebody has 250hp with 1914 and with stock crank and rods... I´ve heard that thouse A pistons can be used with UP to 78mm crank I´m thinking that when I buy 94 pistons this year and crank next year I could build it up to 2165.

A wedgemate is also known as a morse taper, it's when the flywheel and crankshaft are ground to a matching taper or wedge so the crankshaft wedges itself into the flywheel when the assembly is put together. the back face of the crankshaft never touches the face of the flywheel. This makes an extremely strong connection between the crankshaft and the flywheel. If this doesn't make sense read this link from gene berg on the subject.

http://www.geneberg.com/article.php?ArticleID=207

To move up to a 1914cc from a 1585cc you need to machine the piston openings in the engine case and the cylinder heads larger to accept 94mm pistons. You can utilize all the stock parts from the engine as all you are doing is putting bigger pistons in the engine. You will need to set your compression, check your deck height, and make sure your rocker arm geometry is good. You've got to do that with any rebuild so it's not really anything extra besides the machine work for the pistons. You can reuse the pistons for your rebuild later on and just put new piston rings on.

Check this thread out for camshaft selection. Miniman82 has a 1914cc setup so you might want to ask him some questions.

http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... 3&t=106178

[jweir]

There's a turbo 1641cc ( 87mm vs 85.5mm pistons) somewhere on this site that is making well over 200hp and it also has nitrous.

Is that "hyper bug"?

the guy with the stinger on the turbo and a coffee can sized wastegate? that's him. Sweet car.

[1938vw]

There's a turbo 1641cc ( 87mm vs 85.5mm pistons) somewhere on this site that is making well over 200hp and it also has nitrous.

Is that "hyper bug"?

the guy with the stinger on the turbo and a coffee can sized wastegate? that's him. Sweet car.

Very cool car, is there anywhere with the engine details?

[joosep84]

http://www.youtube.com/user/valuveli#p/ ... 1n2pYit7K0

13,9 next to 12.0 nissan

Start:
because of one side soft oil shocks it jumps and it has no traction at all.
Slicks are more than 10 years old and not for dragrace. I couldn´t make a burnout because of bad brakes. 60 feet was 2,2 (We race on concrit)

1 gear....moved nicely like 20-30 times before (10 PSI)
easily to 2 gear and it moved as usually (18 PSI)
Really hard change to 3´d gear (full throttle under boost)
Moved extreamly good until it overboosted.....boost climbed over 30 PSI and plugs couldn´t start the mixture. It didn´t move....I let the gas down for a blink and pressed it again...moved for a while because boost dropped......changed to 4th and it didn´t move because of insane boost (between 30-40 PSI)
Top speed was 5km/h slower than with 14 PSI boost (150 vs 155)
2 pistons were cracked

[jweir]

Do you have a wastegate? 30 psi is ALOT, WAY too much for a stock 1600. 14psi is really starting to pushing it on a stocker IMO. I'm supprised your motor didn't grenade but it looks like it almost did. Were those factory cast pistons? It doesn't really matter I think 30psi would have cracked forged pistons. Probably the result of a lean fuel situation.

try replacing the bushing in the tunnel, that's probably why you're having a hard time hitting 3rd gear. Probably the best $5 you'll spend for better lap times other than a new fuel filter.

[joosep84]

Do you have a wastegate? 30 psi is ALOT, WAY too much for a stock 1600. 14psi is really starting to pushing it on a stocker IMO. I'm supprised your motor didn't grenade but it looks like it almost did. Were those factory cast pistons? It doesn't really matter I think 30psi would have cracked forged pistons. Probably the result of a lean fuel situation.

try replacing the bushing in the tunnel, that's probably why you're having a hard time hitting 3rd gear. Probably the best $5 you'll spend for better lap times other than a new fuel filter.

Ofcourse it was A-lot. I have a WG but I didn´t tune the manual boost controller after changing turbo. just a mistake. My last turbo produced onli 15 PSI with totally closed wg.....I replaced the turbo but near my workshop ( in city) was hard to try it with 3´rd gear and I didn´t know that the boost climbes up. It was normal with 1 and second when I tried it but first time with new turbo and third gear was on track.
Those were stock cast pistons but it wasn´t power what broke them.....it was detonation. (intake temp went up too)



Shifting for 2nd to 3th was hard for gearbox not for me. it´s the only change what is extreamly fast and with full throttle.