Lottery Trans Odd Noise

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Clatter
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Location: Santa Cruz

Lottery Trans Odd Noise

Post by Clatter » Thu Apr 12, 2018 2:08 pm

OK,
This is a long shot, but maybe one of you has some ideas..

Because my last trans died, I went to the Pick 'n Pull and played the lottery.
'Lucked' into a late 3:88 shift-rib, cleaned it up, filled it with some cheap GL4 i had lying around,
stabbed it into my beetle, and took it out for a spin.

Lucky me! It seems like it all works really well,
Shifts easy, quiet on coast and accel, no clunky shifts or odd noises!
WhooHoo!!
After it's maiden voyage on the highway, getting good and hot,
dumped the cheap oil and loaded it up with some Swepco 201.
A few tiny little feathery flakes on the drain plug, but no pieces or parts.

Now, a couple of months sitting later, I got my fairly-hot 1914 done and installed,
go driving around town, and all is well.
Now that the motor is getting broken in, it gets run hard on the highway..

Above 75 or 80-90MPH, decel sounds bad.
Like grinding gravel rocks..
Since the car has a urethane nose cone, padded strap kit, Kafer bar, urethane coupler, and Hurst shifter,
It made me think that there was a shifter/linkage rattle.
Would make sense that the vibrations would set off some kind of gravelly rattling, right?

But,
Dag,
It also sounds like a bearing kind of going,
But it's not a squealing like a bearing, more of a grindy rattle like a shifter..

Hard to describe,
And just goes away at like 70 or 65 or under.

Does anyone have any ideas about how to diagnose what this might be?
Is there some trick to check?
Holding my hand on the shifter doesn't make the sound go away.

What would be a possible worst-case scenario here?

Dag, this thing just works too well in all other ways.

Sorry, long dumb post, but any input is welcome.
"Oh, You don't need to do all that... The valve seats are just going to fall out of it anyway!"
- Doug Ellsworth

Beginners' how-to Type 4 build thread ---> viewtopic.php?f=1&t=145853

Dougy Dee
Posts: 155
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 3:01 am

Re: Lottery Trans Odd Noise

Post by Dougy Dee » Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:46 pm

The flakes could be from the Mainshaft sliding in the MS bearing or case allowing 4th gear teeth to machine the case.

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Clatter
Posts: 1696
Joined: Sun Apr 28, 2002 3:01 am
Location: Santa Cruz

Re: Lottery Trans Odd Noise

Post by Clatter » Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:11 am

I think I found something this might be..

Was digging around here, and found that I might have made a mistake when I switched out the nose-cone.

Can't find the dang post anywhere to quote it,
But,
There's a plastic roller cage on the pinion shaft bearing in the gear carrier, right?
And it sticks forward..
And if you switch from a 3-bolt late nosecone to a two-bolt to make it fit your car,
You'll close up a gap, and the plastic bearing cage will contact the nosecone.

The solution can be one of those thin bearing retainer plate thingys,
Or clearance your nose cone.

So, my question...
This could make noise on decel at speed, right?
The pinion shaft is forced forward some (front of car) when the throttle is lifted?
"Oh, You don't need to do all that... The valve seats are just going to fall out of it anyway!"
- Doug Ellsworth

Beginners' how-to Type 4 build thread ---> viewtopic.php?f=1&t=145853

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Clatter
Posts: 1696
Joined: Sun Apr 28, 2002 3:01 am
Location: Santa Cruz

Re: Lottery Trans Odd Noise

Post by Clatter » Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:23 am

Marc wrote:
Mon Dec 30, 2013 1:15 am
You could just put a pre`73 nosecone on it, but there are issues - the late mainshaft bearing isn't really compatible with the 2-bolt nosecones. Personally I use an aftermarket conversion mount instead. Late chassis have a stud on the LH framehorn for the ground strap (the other end goes to a sidecover stud/nut or bolt); you can weld one onto your chassis or simply use one of the rear mount-to-carrier bolts - it's not a good idea to try and put the ground strap in the early stock location with these urethane mounts. Also, the steel tubes should be a snug fit in the bores of the mount. If they aren't, enlarge their diameter with metallic ductwork tape.

http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Late-3-Bol ... -21-bl.htm
Henryhoehandle wrote:
Tue Dec 31, 2013 11:53 am
The plastic ball seperator on the bearing hits the earlier nosecones. I have seen cases where the bearing was turned over and then the seperator is on 4th gear side and the nosecone can't hit it then.
Henryhoehandle wrote:
Tue Dec 31, 2013 1:09 pm
You can use a thrust plate and the cage/seperator will clear. Or you can clearance the nose cone..mill, burr bit, etc.
"Oh, You don't need to do all that... The valve seats are just going to fall out of it anyway!"
- Doug Ellsworth

Beginners' how-to Type 4 build thread ---> viewtopic.php?f=1&t=145853

Bruce2
Posts: 6852
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2001 3:01 am

Re: Lottery Trans Odd Noise

Post by Bruce2 » Sat Oct 13, 2018 10:21 pm

If you have a grinding noise and you think it's due to the nose cone not clearing the plastic cage, that means the plastic cage has been ripped out. When this happens, the balls go to one side creating a misalignment of the mainshaft.
If you take it out right away, you can probably get away with putting another plastic cage in the bearing. Then clearance the nose cone to clear it.
The last time I installed an early nose cone with the late bearing, I clearanced the plastic cage instead of the nose cone.

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