Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Offroad VW based vehicles have problems/insights all their own. Not to mention the knowledge gained in VW durability.

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dustymojave
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by dustymojave » Fri May 18, 2018 1:21 am

Damn!!! I keep cutting it and it's STILL Too short!!!
:shock:
Richard
Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
Speed Kills!, but then...So does OLD AGE!!
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'58 Baja with 815K Miles and counting

Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Fri May 18, 2018 9:50 am

:lol: Took me a second but I finally got it. Too early in the am after a long night I guess.

It fits but the mounting and "welding to" structural ribs on the towers are very narrow so any bending while clamping shortens the plate enough to cause the plate to draw off the stiffening ribs giving on an "AW $#it" moment then my having to fight to remount and re-center the plate on the tower and it's ribs. I still have to accommodate the two ribs at the top by the flat mounting surface on the shock tower which should help in the fitting of the plate to the tower. Next it is making the two top plates. The neighbors, when they stroll by on their morning or evening walks ask why/how the wooden garage turns a glowing red each time I go out to work on this :twisted: .

Down at the dunes right now to fix a bunch of stuff.

Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Wed May 23, 2018 10:51 pm

Got some garage time so I started to make a pattern for the top of the shock tower. Like the bottom of the tower it is going to be somewhat twisty.
IMG_1213 copy.jpg
You can see some of the high and low spots here.
IMG_1215 copy.jpg
A little bit different view.
IMG_1212 copy.jpg
Cut wide then trip into place. Under the knob for the shock to go through is going to be a project.

Lee
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Thu May 24, 2018 7:39 pm

If you think this is easy... It AIN'T!!!!

Each passing section of the truss/kaffer bar it becomes easier to see why the rail guys get rid of the torsion assy, weld pivots to the frame and go with coil overs and engine mounts. If I had to start over again I would buy a frame like Barrett sells (http://manxchassis.com/).

Got some time in the garage so I cut out the patterns for the top piece of the shock tower. Again, the pattern's weren't that close... as I suspected so there was a lot of rework done.
IMG_1213 copy.jpg
Again, this is the area to be boxed.
IMG_1216 copy.jpg
IMG_1218 copy.jpg
Again, there is some finishing left to be done and some heat bending to get things in alignment.

Lee
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Fri May 25, 2018 6:36 pm

IMG_1220 copy.jpg
Again, this shows how much a what ones thinks as a good paper pattern can be when compared to what the metal part pretty much ends up being after fitting. I still have more work to do but this is pretty close.

I show a bevel on one surface which got me past a problem but the bevel may or may not be there in the final version when some heat bending is done.

Lee
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Wed May 30, 2018 10:35 pm

Got that last piece fitted fairly close but now I have to make a hard decision and that is to disconnect the rear suspension (that has to be done anyway) and pull the transaxle so I can get into a position then re-mount the pan on the rotisserie. This is so I can adjust/rotate things around so I can do the tacking then finish fitting and welding. That means the spreader w/brackets for the mounts and the truss/Kaffer bar and all the support brackets.

I also plan to finish the mounting of the seats and the tuning brake assembly while it is on the rotisserie.

Taking some time off to relax :roll: so we am now in Sun River which is close to La Pine and Bend OR to see my wife's youngest son. It is almost a 400 mile drive which is about the distance to the dunes for us. Cool during the dark hours and not bad during the day or so I have been told.

I also have the other BJ beam to rebuild/update along with the Thing spindles and BJs along with some other things that might need to be done to do some other nasty things. Busy, busy, busy!

Lee

Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Fri Jun 08, 2018 6:14 pm

Its raining out so I got some garage time. I decided to weld the pivot mounts onto the spreader bar.
IMG_1221 copy.jpg


The pivots are an 1" wide so I marked the side locations...
IMG_1222 copy.jpg
Then located the brackets between the lines to make sure I didn't put a twist in.
IMG_1223 copy.jpg
They are now welded in place. Because I don't weld that much and add to that the eye disease with also makes me light sensitive to things like welding plus I have and all the surgery my welding usually isn't "purdy" but usually strong. I'll clean it up and post later.

After posting a pix the other day that showed my oil filter I got looking at the blue buggy I have. It has a "U"-shaped spreader bar under the seat (a not real pretty not is it a strong way of doing it) and the cage's down bars are welded to it (ersatzly). I am now thinking about doing the same design to it as the current design won't even allow the commercial truss bars to connect to the shock towers.

Lee
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Sat Jun 09, 2018 11:57 am

I thought you might be interested.

When I went up to buy some recycled 1 X 3 X 0.125 rectangular tube seemed to be a bit heavier than the same material I had bought before. I noticed that the radius was also greater but wasn't sure if it would make a difference... it seems to. when I was trying to clean the protective coating off it the coating was difficult to get off; I used lacquer thinner and a sanding disc. just for the heck of it I took a duplicator to the corner and to the corner of the same stock size but 0.095 wall thickness which is about the same as the 0.125 tube I had bought before but in a shorter length (it is now used up).
IMG_1224 copy.jpg
The corner on the left is the 0.095 while the one on the right is the 0.125.

I also had a piece of 1 1/2 X 3 X 0.125 rectangular tube I had used for the body lift and the corner there is similar to the 0.095.
IMG_1225 copy.jpg
This shows all three of them together. The larger radius is noticabally heavier when compared to the thinner walled stuff and als doesn't like to be welded to. Ignoring my crappy welding there was a lot of spitting and stopping of welding in areas. I tried adding more heat but that did not feel right at all.

Lee
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Wed Jun 20, 2018 4:30 pm

Been pretty busy the last few weeks plus not being at home which kind of put things here behind. Were taking my wife's daughter to Ocean Shores WA this weekend for the sand castle and chainsaw carving competition. It is usually pretty good thing to see but not sure about the weather or temperatures.

On the buggy: I've kind of run into a problem and that is with the mounting the pan back onto the rotisserie in order to weld the boxing plates to the shock tower.
IMG_1228 copy.jpg
I have fill some gaps in the spreader bar where the brackets were welded into place that could hold wet salt laden sand in place so some filling and one seam I missed will have to be done. It is nice to be able to rotate the pan to get a good angle to the joins in order to weld them up seamless.
IMG_1229 copy.jpg
This is where the main problem seems to be. Since I am going to have to (I think so anyway) weld two of the posts for the fuel tank to the solid motor mount the mount I made for the rear to go onto the rotisserie will not fit. the flanges are between 1 1/2" and 1 3/4" long and I can't get a fine thread metric bolt in the length I need at my local fastener store. Medium threads but not fine threads which the motor mount uses.
IMG_1230 copy.jpg
This is the other problem. The rear mounts for the AL tank will sit on the motor mount but not as shown here but on the other side of the flange. I need the mount there so when the body is put back on I can do a cut and fit to make the tank go where I want it to sit and at the height I also want it. It will require a temporary tool to be made but there is a no big deal to that.
7-28-2010 002 (2).JPG
While it is back on the rotisserie I will finish mounting the seats plus the turning brake handles and the remote turning brake cylinders. I might even get to do some other things that require the body on... or off.

Lee
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:06 am

Oops! :oops: :roll: When I welded up the mounts on the spreader bar I somehow goofed when marking the bar to locate them so each sits to the driver's side about and inch which makes the alignment to the motor mount way off. I am going to have to cut them loose and reweld them in. Not sure when I going be able to get back into the garage to do it; it might take a while due tp some other things going on.

Lee

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dustymojave
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by dustymojave » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:04 pm

What do you need those vertical bars for? The transverse bar will be strong enough to support the tank between the braces you made the brackets for. The weight of the tank will be applied to the transverse bar at the tank mounts, which should be spread at 1/4 to 1/3 in from the ends. Even if the tank mounts are near the ends, you're even better then. But now you're working on vertical supports that won't clear the headers out of the forward cylinders. You're confusing me again Lee.
Richard
Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
Speed Kills!, but then...So does OLD AGE!!
A.R.T.S. OffRoad Race Tech Inspection
MDR / MORE / Glen Helen BajaCup Challenge
AKA: MojaveRacer208
'58 Baja with 815K Miles and counting

Ol'fogasaurus
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Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 1:17 am
Location: Just north of Seattle

Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:16 pm

You've been kind of a "lost soul" lately. Are you OK?
IMG_0962 copy.jpg
Remember when I posted this picture... well it is wrong, wrong, wrong and for several reasons. This shows the seat in the forward most position but I will be sitting more to the rear position. The rear position is ~4" from the rear of the pan, by the rear crosspiece which is where the rear hoop of the cage will be mounted. The spreader bar is roughly 12" away from where the cage will be. The rear hoop of the cage will be mounted in the in the very corner where the crosspiece meets the side of the pan. I want to "bridge" the rear of the engine and trans frame (AKA "pickle fork") into the cage for some additional strength and to keep the truss setup just like the commercial POS does and that is to keep all the loading in the torsion tube. Remember, that the torsion tube can rotate as a unit in a hard hit. I have seen hits hard enough to break the torsion tube loose on a rail and break the shock towers on an old cheap rail. One of our guys landed hard enough on a measured 80' jump (I've seen the video but it is now missing after a divorce) on the flat ocean beach to cause the pickle forks to take a permanent deep sag! Remember, for several reasons a glass buggy is a lot less strong than a Baja or a rail because of no roof needed for spreading loads around or as good of a cage for spreading loads out also.

I don't drive my blue buggy hard... I "cruise" on the dunes (I usually go to the ocean beach, setup my tent and beach chairs to read and watch people drive by) but remember when I had to crest of a dune collapse on me allowing my buggy to drop close to 20' then land hard enough that the suspension to bottom out jamming my back. My back was sore for 3+ months after that landing.

After I made several changes to how it sits now there was the second crest failure and drop almost in the same spot with the same distance of drop but this time I was better setup but still...crap can happen anytime.

I try to plan ahead and quite often I over do things but a couple of times it has ended being to my advantage that I did over do things.

Sorry about confusing you :wink:

Lee
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Wed Jul 04, 2018 10:52 am

I got a new laptop ($$$) the other day and I am trying to figure out how to use it for things other than swatting flies. Its one you can draw in. Add to that I am also on a reading jag (again) too plus I have to be careful not to make things worse for no big deal surgery (close but a bit more than having a wart removed). I'm at book 21 in a 30 book series by an English author.

If I can get good enough with the abilities of the new laptop I'll try to redo the last picture and try to make things a bit clearer (hopefully :oops: ). It's like anything else: one thing begets something(s) else and so it goes on and on (you know the rest of the saying :roll: :lol: From the poem Siphonaptera: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siphonaptera_(poem) ). Dusty's suggestion would sure make things easier but I (think I) want to do things right; e.g., more correct this time ("right" would take me in a completely different direction [pun intended]. Two wrongs don't make a right but three lefts do!).

Lee

Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Wed Jul 04, 2018 4:28 pm

If NC was going to start a war nobody here would notice. For a town that did not allow fireworks it sounds like a full scale invasion! :lol: Just had a big boom sounding more like someone slamming a door shut but all the doors in our house are shut tight.

I tried to cut the mounts off the spreader bar but it looks like I did a better job of welding than I though :roll: .

I'm beginning to think that I will not put the notched mounts for the cage on the spreader but have who ever builds my cage drop the down tubes down, add feet to to each and connect it to the spreader then live with it :roll: . Since I have to have the cage go through the front cowl I am giving up makeing it removable and have it mounted directly to the body lift for strength.

"The best plans of mice and men often go awry" :roll: . John Steinbeck 1937

Lee

Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Ol'fogasaurus black buggy

Post by Ol'fogasaurus » Wed Jul 11, 2018 2:56 pm

Too much other stuff to do lately to work on the buggy, also getting ready for some minor surgery. I met the surgeon and he was so impressed with me that he immediately retired. :roll: :lol: The (minor?) surgery is still on so to make sure that this doesn't happen again the Dr. who will replace the retiring Dr.'s pre-surgery visit will be by phone :wink: this time.

Anyway, I went up and got some metal out of a salvage yard today, the price sure has gone up. A 4' length of 1 X 3 X 0.125 wall went from something like $18 to just over $23. For some reason, this length of tube feels lighter than the previous one of the same thickness but the radiuses are also less generous which was causing a problem. I just went out and hefted the two and the uncut 4' length compared to the cut down previous piece with the two brackets welded in place is a big difference. One would think that they should be very close to being the same weight as the brackets were made from the end tailings of an older 0.125 length of tube. The old piece just feels different and I can't explain the feeling. I wonder if the material mix is different (dense ?) which causes the weigh difference.

I also got some metal to redesign the bending tools I built just to see if it could be done and work... which it did. I need to be able to bend to a 5" width maybe so that is what I got... the material to do a more than 90° bend... just-in-case.

Lee

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