Seat belt years / rear anchors?

[KarenTheBug]

I know 1962 was when the Beetle got seat belt anchor points - was that just for the front, or front and back?

Just curious mostly. My 1971 had the rear seat belts removed by a previous owner, and the front lift latch seat belts were replaced with retractables by a previous owner as well. I've put the chrome lift latch style back up front, and am about to put a matching pair in the rear, when I got to thinking about when they first started putting them in.

Another question: I had my entire rear seat (top & bottom) out a month or two ago to check for rust, and when I did I saw the obvious two anchor points in the center under the tray for one side of the belts - is the other anchor point the unused bolt hole in the side panel, near where the rear seatback pivots (or did I just discover ANOTHER mystery item a previous owner removed)?

[aussiebug]

Yes, the side seat belt mounts in the back are close to the seat back pivots and have captive nuts.

Different countries had different rules for fitting of seatbelts and VW was ahead of it's time in providing anchor points from 62 onwards. For example, Australia required front belts from 70 onwards and rear belts from 72 onwards. So when I bought my 1970 bug (brand new - still have it) the first thing I did was to fit rear belts.

I think the US required seats belt earlier than 1970 (anyone?)

[Marc]

Six US states required front seatbelt anchor points in 1962; all US manufacturers (and some foreign) furnished those then. The belts themselves were typically dealer- or owner-installed.
By 1965, all US automakers provided lap belts in the front (outboard) seats...Volvo had 3-point fronts in `63.
Nat'l Highway Safety Board (now NHTSA) introduced standards for seat belts in 1967 - lap belts req'd effective March `67.
Front (outboard) shoulder harnesses required in USA Jan 1st 1968.

VW introduced the inertia-reel belt for the `73 model. The 3-point belts used for `68-`72 had to be manually adjusted, when the shoulder harness portion was snug enough to properly function you felt captive in the car...couldn't even reach into the glovebox from the driver's seat. Acknowledging that people weren't going to tolerate that and would intentionally adjust the shoulder harness loose, VW provided little spring-loaded reels which clipped onto the belt and took up the slack so the belt would at least stay above the shoulder where it had a chance of helping some in a collision. Few of these Mickey-Mouse devices survive...

[KarenTheBug]

Thanks for the info! When I bought my 1971 bug the front belts had been replaced with inertia reels (not sure if they were aftermarket or true VW). The driver's side reel started a neat little trick where it would grab hold of the belt & not release it, so as you were driving it would get tighter & tighter. No matter what I did to adjust them, the problem never went away so I pulled them and replaced the front with three point chrome lift latch style belts (the ones you described, non-retractable). The rear seat belts were totally missing when I bought her, and just yesterday or the day before I finally put in a pair of lap belts in the same non-retractible chrome lift latch style to match the front - I can post a pic later.

My bug had rear seat belts at one point in her life, I'm almost certain - there were bolts in the mounting points, and they had plastic sleeves that looked pretty worn, so someone had to remove them at some point.

[Marc]

Yeah, your `71 had rear lap belts from the factory.
The inertia-reel belts are sensitive to gravity, too - the reel needs to be close to vertical for them to pay out. There's a little spike on the backside of the mounting bracket that goes into a hole in the B-pillar to keep the reel upright, if it's not there they'll act up.

[Stray Catalyst]

Old cars, especially VWs, tend to be a combination of archaeology and forensics to figure out which corners the PO(s) decided to cut... with the older ones, you get generations of repairs, or sometimes just layers of them. I'm doing bodywork on a 64 bus, and I can sometimes tell which repairs were done by the original owner (a fire department in Germany) as opposed to the second owner, an American serviceman.

Stray

[56bugdan]

Okay since we're on the subject, what are guys doin about rear seatbelts in the older (1956) type 1s? Thing is, I wanna be able to drive my kids to shows in it but I'd like to have some type of belts for them.

[Marc]

Most folks just drill bolt holes and use big washers on the backside, but you're ambitious you can do better.
http://www.thebugshop.org/bsp57_10.htm

[56bugdan]

Most folks just drill bolt holes and use big washers on the backside, but you're ambitious you can do better.
http://www.thebugshop.org/bsp57_10.htm

Yeah, you're absolutely right. We can do much better than that. Guess I'll weld a plates and nuts so their secure and don't pull through if the worst should happen. Thanks

[71superAS]

Can you show me an example of the chrome lift-latch belts you are talking about?

[KarenTheBug]

http://www.jbugs.com/product/ZVW20-BLAC ... seat-belts

http://www.jbugs.com/product/ZVW20A-BLA ... seat-belts

I've got a pair of three points up front, and a pair of lap only in the back. The Wolfsburg crest on these is actually a die-cut vinyl decal that you stick on the buckle yourself on installation, and I left mine off so they're just bare chrome. They're great, look very stylish (especially with the stock 1962 - 1971 steering wheel), and are very comfortable. Only draw back is that when reaching in your right pocket (as the driver, or as the passenger reaching in your left pocket) you run the risk of accidentally un-buckling them if you're not careful - easy to catch the latch with the side of your hand, sleeve, etc.

[71superAS]

Wow, I really like those!

Thanks for the tip, those are going on my list.

[MexBug]

Thanks for the info. I have to install belts in my Mexican bug so we can bring the kid. Turns out my MEXICAN bug has almost all prepared. Only need to open up the holes in the center. The other already ready to install in(with some backing plates welded in ofcourse.)
The bug sure is a world car!

[Batghia]

1974 Ghia convertible. I want to R&R the 3 point belts anchored in the rear. I can't find a way to get the inertia reels out. They won't fit under the rear heat tubes in the bodywork. Any help out there?

[Ol'fogasaurus]

""I think the US required seats belt earlier than 1970 (anyone?)"

If I remember correctly is was sometime around '56 give or take a couple of years. My parents '56 ford many door sedan had them.(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seat_belt)

Lee