2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

With Turbo and Super charging you can create massive horsepower with vw motors.
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split1950
Posts: 102
Joined: Thu May 16, 2019 9:08 am

2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by split1950 » Tue May 21, 2019 2:53 pm

I'm building a matching numbers 1950 Beetle and wanted some fun, so I'm using a different pan with IRS and some trick parts, a 915 5 speed off a 3.0SC (not what this thread is about :P ) and a 2000cc type 4 engine I picked up - now we're talking!
Basic specs are
2270cc
New 914 heads, 44x38mm Manley valves, ported, 7.7:1 CR
ARP head studs and rod bolts
78mm DPR crank
Cunningham H beam rods
Custom forged 96mm JE pistons
Custom Web cam on 112LC
Lightweight type 1 lifters
Manton pushrods
Double valve springs
Dry sump oiling
EFR7670 Turbo - some nice A/R advise from Wally - thanks dude!
DTA S60 ECU
Chargecooler made from a S3 intercooler.
911 upright cooling because it looks nice. Again not the topic of this thread :P
KEP 915 flywheel and Porsche HD lightweight racing clutch

This is my first engine build, so I'm learning as I go.
I came up with the spec, but I must admit I've had some advise from Stateside tuning here in the UK to reign things in a bit, and JC did my case machining and balancing for me. He's a top guy.
I've done everything else.
The target is >300BHP. I'm not sure how I arrived at that number, it felt right.
I cleaned everything three times then put stuff together with assembly lube
Some pics
Crankcase after line bore, sleeving for lifters etc
20181208_154736.jpg
crank built up with rods
20181208_154521.jpg
20181208_154528.jpg
Crank in the case
20181212_185515.jpg
20181229_152710.jpg
Some parts
20181215_140351.jpg
20181215_140425.jpg
20181215_150401.jpg
20181224_133608.jpg
20181230_150005.jpg
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Last edited by split1950 on Wed May 22, 2019 1:08 am, edited 7 times in total.

split1950
Posts: 102
Joined: Thu May 16, 2019 9:08 am

Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by split1950 » Tue May 21, 2019 3:05 pm

Cylinders and pistons in
20181230_163337.jpg
Those JE spiral clips are fiddly to get in!
20181230_163005.jpg
Love those pistons!
Long block (I think)
20190115_190229.jpg
To get even cylinder cooling I came up with this mod to what was on the back of the fan.
It's shaped to be really close to the fan shroud and hopefully evenly direct the air over each cylinder
20190128_160220.jpg
20190128_160146.jpg
20190129_181935.jpg
20190129_181928.jpg
20190129_181943.jpg
20190129_181952.jpg
You might have noticed the dizzy on there, I'm doing the cam break in with carbs and single valve springs to protect the lobes.
I made a test thing out of a bus bell housing
20190325_140043.jpg
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Last edited by split1950 on Wed May 22, 2019 1:42 am, edited 2 times in total.

split1950
Posts: 102
Joined: Thu May 16, 2019 9:08 am

Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by split1950 » Tue May 21, 2019 3:07 pm

20190325_141015.jpg
20190322_153234.jpg
20190325_141712.jpg
Valve geometry set at 50% lift (6.50mm on DTI) (via custom length pushrods)
20190307_153359.jpg
20190307_153604.jpg
with a full lift of 12.99mm
20190307_153231.jpg
all worked out with a homemade adjustable T4 pushrod
20190305_153002.jpg
I need to take some more photos...........
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Last edited by split1950 on Wed May 22, 2019 1:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

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buguy
Posts: 5577
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 11:53 pm

Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by buguy » Tue May 21, 2019 6:15 pm

Looks good. 300 HP should be easy with that!

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panel
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Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by panel » Tue May 21, 2019 10:45 pm

Nice pulley!
'65 Bus with a JDM Subaru EJ20 Turbo
Built by Germans powered by Japanese and brought together by Canadians

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rubenski
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Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by rubenski » Wed May 22, 2019 1:46 am

Looks good!
Better to be blown than to suck!

Bruce.m
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Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by Bruce.m » Wed May 22, 2019 3:42 am

Where did you source the heads from?

split1950
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Joined: Thu May 16, 2019 9:08 am

Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by split1950 » Wed May 22, 2019 5:45 am

Heads are from Stateside Tuning here in the UK.
JC did the machining for the big valves and porting on them.

Bruce.m
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2013 3:44 pm

Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by Bruce.m » Wed May 22, 2019 1:38 pm

Based on bare AA castings?
Don’t see any sign of welding etc to convert the inlet studs or plug threads.

Be interested to know if that’s the case & therefore if they rate the casting as good enough.

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Wally
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Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by Wally » Wed May 22, 2019 1:45 pm

Very nice build!
Those new 914 cores are a GREAT base for this build, especially since you didn't weaken them by machining them out for 103mm or so..
My only remark would be the overly safe compression ratio. Ok with a stock cam, but I think your custom cam probably has some more duration then stock hence even lowering the dynamic compression some more. Sounds like a Stateside advise perhaps? :wink:

About the turbo: Since you didn't mention EFR in your post in my thread, I assumed you were talking about the 'regular' BorgWarner 7670 turbo (S200-SX-E), which uses the T3/T4 turbine housings. Those have T4 bolt pattern BTW, so any regular T4 turbine (if you want to up the size later) will always fit.
That BW 7670 turbo is this one:
https://www.full-race.com/store/toyota/ ... xe-7670-1/

As these days, that turbo now has the billet compressor wheel and is the same one as the EFR7670. Only the EFR7670 is more then twice (!) as expensive..
That makes this turbo such a good deal.

The EFR (engineered for racing) has the ceramic ball bearings, Titanium-Aluminium exhaust wheel, stainless turbine housing and an internal BOV, which makes it that expensive at the gain of exceptional transitions (spool-up between changing gears for instance).
Its this one:
https://www.full-race.com/store/borg-wa ... 0-turbo-2/
With this turbo, get the 1.05 A/R T4 twin scroll turbine housing. This is a truly T4 housing, so even though 1.05 sounds smaller then 1.22 of the above turbo, its actually a little bigger...
This spools my 2,2ltr very fast with awesome response, but not too early so I can cruise just off-boost at 2400 RPM (0.1 bar boost) and 100km/h in 5th :wink:

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Wally
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Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by Wally » Wed May 22, 2019 1:48 pm

Bruce.m wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 1:38 pm
Based on bare AA castings?
Don’t see any sign of welding etc to convert the inlet studs or plug threads.

Be interested to know if that’s the case & therefore if they rate the casting as good enough.
The new AA 914 2.0 castings are very nice! I've seen a set IRL and its great value for money and lots better then 50 year old castings any day.
How the AA casting rates versus the AMC ones, I dunno yet, but the AMC casting might be even a tiny touch harder alloy, but that was my 'feel' of them and based on zero actual measurement FYI.

Bruce.m
Posts: 250
Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2013 3:44 pm

Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by Bruce.m » Wed May 22, 2019 2:49 pm

Thanks :)

split1950
Posts: 102
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Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by split1950 » Wed May 22, 2019 4:15 pm

Wally wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 1:45 pm
Very nice build!
Those new 914 cores are a GREAT base for this build, especially since you didn't weaken them by machining them out for 103mm or so..
My only remark would be the overly safe compression ratio. Ok with a stock cam, but I think your custom cam probably has some more duration then stock hence even lowering the dynamic compression some more. Sounds like a Stateside advise perhaps? :wink:

About the turbo: Since you didn't mention EFR in your post in my thread, I assumed you were talking about the 'regular' BorgWarner 7670 turbo (S200-SX-E), which uses the T3/T4 turbine housings. Those have T4 bolt pattern BTW, so any regular T4 turbine (if you want to up the size later) will always fit.
That BW 7670 turbo is this one:
https://www.full-race.com/store/toyota/ ... xe-7670-1/

As these days, that turbo now has the billet compressor wheel and is the same one as the EFR7670. Only the EFR7670 is more then twice (!) as expensive..
That makes this turbo such a good deal.

The EFR (engineered for racing) has the ceramic ball bearings, Titanium-Aluminium exhaust wheel, stainless turbine housing and an internal BOV, which makes it that expensive at the gain of exceptional transitions (spool-up between changing gears for instance).
Its this one:
https://www.full-race.com/store/borg-wa ... 0-turbo-2/
With this turbo, get the 1.05 A/R T4 twin scroll turbine housing. This is a truly T4 housing, so even though 1.05 sounds smaller then 1.22 of the above turbo, its actually a little bigger...
This spools my 2,2ltr very fast with awesome response, but not too early so I can cruise just off-boost at 2400 RPM (0.1 bar boost) and 100km/h in 5th :wink:
HI Wally!

Thanks!
I initially wanted 103mm but Stateside talked me out of it and so I went for the DPR 78mm crank.
Then also Yes, I wanted a higher CR but Stateside was really against it too. Having no experience it was a hard decision, I spent a lot of money so took his advise. I figured that later I could maybe change it if necessary. It's not a big deal as I have 0.5mm cylinder spacers & 1mm copper sealing rings I suppose. I'd need to do the calculations. For the boost he said to use 7PSI, errm, no way dude, I'm going to try and build up to 15 PSI and see how it feels.
About the turbo, I'm going to go for EFR7670 with the 1.05 A/R then, it sounds like by 3000RPM I'll be on boost and smiling! The 915 gearing should be OK.
I really appreciate that benefit of your experience, it would have cost me a lot of money in trial and error!

I've done the cam break in on carbs and a dizzy last Saturday. It was quite stressful to start it and bring the revs up to 2K~3K for 20 minutes. I didn't post the video because I'm missing the pictures of my homemade engine test bench, I'm quite happy with what I made there!
I had a small oil leak from the fan belt pully oil seal, it looks like maybe between seal and case, I'm not sure, I'm working away again this week so can't check until the weekend. I'm planning to pull the seal and have a look. I have a new seal, I might put some permatex around that before I put it in. Otherwise it's a crankcase breathing issue if it's getting through the seal?, but if oil came out by the hub it would have sprayed everywhere?.....mmmmm
Frankly if that's all the problems I was lucky for my first build.
Once that's sorted I'll pull the heads and get the dual valve springs in and get on with a header, throttle bodies and learning how to map the ECU.

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Wally
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Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by Wally » Thu May 23, 2019 12:08 pm

Cheers mate!
You know, if you just stay at 15 psi max and have no plans to go higher, you´ll never take advantage of the full potential of that EFR7670. In that case, you could also opt for the smaller EFR7163 which will spool even faster, say 400 RPM or so I guesstimate. Its still a 450-500hp turbo fully wind-up where the EFR7670 will go on at 2 bar boost and over to 550-600hp.
For street use and under 1,5 bar boost, the EFR7163 would be even better spool-wise.
Up to you, its an awesome line of turbo's any which way imo.

split1950
Posts: 102
Joined: Thu May 16, 2019 9:08 am

Re: 2270cc type 4 EFI Turbo: my first engine build

Post by split1950 » Thu May 23, 2019 12:27 pm

Wally wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 12:08 pm
Cheers mate!
You know, if you just stay at 15 psi max and have no plans to go higher, you´ll never take advantage of the full potential of that EFR7670. In that case, you could also opt for the smaller EFR7163 which will spool even faster, say 400 RPM or so I guesstimate. Its still a 450-500hp turbo fully wind-up where the EFR7670 will go on at 2 bar boost and over to 550-600hp.
For street use and under 1,5 bar boost, the EFR7163 would be even better spool-wise.
Up to you, its an awesome line of turbo's any which way imo.
Yeah I don't know how high to go on the boost until I try it. I'd like to go 20+ PSI finally providing it cools OK. Do you think it can take it?
I've tried to get the best parts I can to maximise realiablity and give me flexibility to push it, but I will go with the boost step by step.
On the other hand I don't want to buy a Turbo then change it for a bigger one, it's lost cash.
I love my 1000cc bikes (I also have a GSXR1000 and do track riding) so I'm used to a bit of power and the rush, you can never have enough right?
Decisions decisions!

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