I am going to attach/weld the sides on my buggy using 22ga material. Would it be best to bend the edges and weld them or just cut to fit and weld into place?
What would be the best way to put a dbl edge on the metal?
Rail buggy body
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Rail buggy body
Are you talking about a rolled edge Leather? Without making a buck or buying a bead roller to get the bend started (in the $180 to $200 price range for a HF unit) you could go this way (a very quick and basic overview): If it is a straight line you could draw a line indicating the roll then clamp the material down using a long straight piece that you will slowly roll the bend over, remove the straight edge the finish rolling the bend. Use a plastic hammer and work in long sections slowly making the bends so you don't tear the metal. I would do some practice pieces first.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZSxhj_2Avg
Flanging tool and spot weld puch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5uuZ1uW ... re=related
Another on flanging tool
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRZb9Zm3 ... re=related
Bead roller
Could that dot edu post get to be a sticky? It is getting harder to find all the time.
Lee
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZSxhj_2Avg
Flanging tool and spot weld puch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5uuZ1uW ... re=related
Another on flanging tool
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRZb9Zm3 ... re=related
Bead roller
Could that dot edu post get to be a sticky? It is getting harder to find all the time.
Lee
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Leatherneck
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Re: Rail buggy body
Thanks Lee, guess what I am thinking is would it be better to cut the sides to fit and weld or cut the sides to fit bend over the edge to double it then weld it. Is that second step necessary? OR just cut and weld to the tubing? Will find out about your sticky. Thanks Lee.
I am thinking about buying a bead roller, found one for about 135 shipped. http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-SHEET-METAL ... 564702875e. i know to beef up the strength of the panels I should add something. Still tossing all of this around in my head. Really causing delays.
I am thinking about buying a bead roller, found one for about 135 shipped. http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-SHEET-METAL ... 564702875e. i know to beef up the strength of the panels I should add something. Still tossing all of this around in my head. Really causing delays.
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Rail buggy body
It’s the rain that is causing delays here. Rain, heavy rain, hail, thunder boomers, you'd think it was spring rather than fall/winter.
That is a good price for the bead roller; it is the same one as shown in the videos I posted.
You might want to take a gander at the soft back book: How to build a Dune Buggy by Earl Duty published by cars & parts magazine. On page 208, there is a chapter titled: Fabricating the body Panels. It might help you on your project. The chapter goes to page 215 and has pictures. It is just one way of accomplishing this task and their job looks pretty good.
For long bends you might look up a sheet metal shop of some kind or a HVAC shop. Quite often they will do bend on their brakes for car people for free or a nominal price as some of them are car people themselves.
Lee
That is a good price for the bead roller; it is the same one as shown in the videos I posted.
You might want to take a gander at the soft back book: How to build a Dune Buggy by Earl Duty published by cars & parts magazine. On page 208, there is a chapter titled: Fabricating the body Panels. It might help you on your project. The chapter goes to page 215 and has pictures. It is just one way of accomplishing this task and their job looks pretty good.
For long bends you might look up a sheet metal shop of some kind or a HVAC shop. Quite often they will do bend on their brakes for car people for free or a nominal price as some of them are car people themselves.
Lee
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Leatherneck
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Re: Rail buggy body
After much digging I located my copy of How to build a Dune Buggy. He used 040 for panels, didn't double the edges and riveted them to the tubing. I may check and see what 040 aluminum will run me over what I already have.
Not sure about drilling and riveting to the body, maybe not a bad idea, something else to ponder. also dug up some old Hot VW to look at their projects and articles.
Not sure about drilling and riveting to the body, maybe not a bad idea, something else to ponder. also dug up some old Hot VW to look at their projects and articles.
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Rail buggy body
.040 should be OK (sorry, I don’t think in gauges, dimensions of the material is what I worked in for so long). I agree with you that attaching to the frame via holes in the tube and rivets is not good; tabs welded to the tube should be a better way.
Notice that they use beading to stiffen up the flat stock. A light brake bending also works but is not as slightly in appearance as beading would be. Look closely to see how they did it. You want to cover twisting at the corners while protecting the length and height from flexing.
Today on the Trucks portion of the Saturday and Sunday shows they are doing metal work. They show how to do bucks and bend metal around them. There are also other things like doing slots in heavier material. The show will be on tomorrow and since you are thinking in this subject, if you can get it the half hour spent may be worth it. It is not what they are doing; it is how they are doing it.
They also talk about countersinking but what they end up with is flanged holes which are different than dimples for flush fit fasteners; dimples are shorter in height and do not have a flange on them. I guess this is another case of a name bleeding over to something else.
Lee
Notice that they use beading to stiffen up the flat stock. A light brake bending also works but is not as slightly in appearance as beading would be. Look closely to see how they did it. You want to cover twisting at the corners while protecting the length and height from flexing.
Today on the Trucks portion of the Saturday and Sunday shows they are doing metal work. They show how to do bucks and bend metal around them. There are also other things like doing slots in heavier material. The show will be on tomorrow and since you are thinking in this subject, if you can get it the half hour spent may be worth it. It is not what they are doing; it is how they are doing it.
They also talk about countersinking but what they end up with is flanged holes which are different than dimples for flush fit fasteners; dimples are shorter in height and do not have a flange on them. I guess this is another case of a name bleeding over to something else.
Lee
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Leatherneck
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Re: Rail buggy body
So have gone away from the steel panel to using a .040 aluminum panel using dzus fasteners. I will weld on the tabs to the frame so I can finish the frame and paint. Then I will make the body, saying body actually 2 sides and a hood. Bought a Eastwoods bead roller so will be playing with that also.
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Leatherneck
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Re: Rail buggy body
Doing some playing around with the bead roller.
Did a free hand drawing to see how it works. Started with this, going to be the firewall in front. When I drew the lines I first started rolling it with keeping the bead in the middle, found out if I put the roller on the edge of the line it was a lot easier to follow.
Did a free hand drawing to see how it works. Started with this, going to be the firewall in front. When I drew the lines I first started rolling it with keeping the bead in the middle, found out if I put the roller on the edge of the line it was a lot easier to follow.
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Rail buggy body
Very good Leather, I am impressed. 
The learning curve looks like it is going to quick for you then things are going to speed things up I bet. Don’t get too complacent on initial success (beginner’s luck so to speak).
I wonder if when you make a cutting pattern if you can tape it down and use the line on the pattern to use as the beading line. Try it on a coupon first to see if it even works (I'm guessing here) or its too much bother or becomes a mess.
Yes, it is probably best to be able to see the line when you roll. Lazze is so good he doesn't have to, he looks at the monitor which shows the lines for his work and there you go.
For the long straight lines, look at the adjustable stop Lazze made for his bead roller. You should be able to build something like that; its a pretty simple design even if you only clamp it on the frame of the bead roller, it is going to have to help with the long straight lines.
Bead inside or bead outside?
Lee
The learning curve looks like it is going to quick for you then things are going to speed things up I bet. Don’t get too complacent on initial success (beginner’s luck so to speak). I wonder if when you make a cutting pattern if you can tape it down and use the line on the pattern to use as the beading line. Try it on a coupon first to see if it even works (I'm guessing here) or its too much bother or becomes a mess.
Yes, it is probably best to be able to see the line when you roll. Lazze is so good he doesn't have to, he looks at the monitor which shows the lines for his work and there you go.
For the long straight lines, look at the adjustable stop Lazze made for his bead roller. You should be able to build something like that; its a pretty simple design even if you only clamp it on the frame of the bead roller, it is going to have to help with the long straight lines.Bead inside or bead outside?
Lee
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Leatherneck
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Re: Rail buggy body
Complacent, ha! It is all a brand new world to me. Lots of practice to do. Have to see what different designs, ie: oval, square etc. do to the metal. Bead out my friend.
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Ol'fogasaurus
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Re: Rail buggy body
A perimeter bead around three sides, the top, bottom and the rear then at the forward end; no perimeter bead but flames going back a ways? Make a coupon on this if it sounds interesting.
One thought: I think I would do the bead work first then cut the panel to shape. You are stretching the metal making the bead but since you are not using tooling to hold the flat stock in place to keep it from shrinking during the bead rolling process so there has to be some shrinkage introduced; this is why I think I would bead then cut to size after finishing the bead.
Just a thought you might want to look into.
You might want to look into a plastic headed hammer for straightening and maybe a block of hard wood to spread the loads around. No smacking things, just some love taps on the block of wood to let the metal know what you want it to do.
Lee
One thought: I think I would do the bead work first then cut the panel to shape. You are stretching the metal making the bead but since you are not using tooling to hold the flat stock in place to keep it from shrinking during the bead rolling process so there has to be some shrinkage introduced; this is why I think I would bead then cut to size after finishing the bead.
Just a thought you might want to look into.
You might want to look into a plastic headed hammer for straightening and maybe a block of hard wood to spread the loads around. No smacking things, just some love taps on the block of wood to let the metal know what you want it to do.
Lee