Roller lifters for a wbx case

Torch · Post by **Torch** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:45 pm

Has anyone done this? I really like the idea, but is the lifter gussets strong enough?

Passatman · Post by **Passatman** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:27 pm

Yes it can be done. A guy over by the cal-look forum by the name of eaallard
has done it but it was for an oxyboxer conversion.

pocketrocket · Post by **pocketrocket** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:37 pm

I do the rollers in a WBX block. Thanks Rocky

pocketrocket · Post by **pocketrocket** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:43 pm

I did the block with rollers on stripped66 engine.

Post by **Piledriver** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 10:26 pm

Will they hold up on the street/daily driver, or race only/low mileage?

Passatman · Post by **Passatman** » Sat Feb 02, 2008 6:06 am

pocketrocket wrote:I did the block with rollers on stripped66 engine.

Ah! got my info wrong again. Torch rocky is the man you need for this work.

Stripped66 · Post by **Stripped66** » Sun Feb 03, 2008 4:19 pm

Piledriver wrote:Will they hold up on the street/daily driver, or race only/low mileage?

So far it's holding up on a daily driven engine, but I haven't logged lots of miles yet. There are a handful of *issues* you need to consider/address outside of the lifters themselves (e.g. the rest of the valvetrain)...but it's doable.

Post by **Piledriver** » Sun Feb 03, 2008 8:32 pm

Cool... I'm looking at doing something a bit more radical for the Pile, and putting the mildly boosted 2.0 in the T3.

Have the cam blank prices fallen from the stratosphere yet?

Stripped66 · Post by **Stripped66** » Sun Feb 03, 2008 10:12 pm

Cam blanks are not terribly expensive...IIRC, around $150 or less. It's the cost to grind the cam and heat-treat it that adds up.

Pauter has cams in stock for about $420. My cam *was* the smallest grind they offerred (256@ 0.050", .380 at the lobe), but Don has ground an even smaller cam for his big-block that he runs on the street, so that pattern is probably available. I don't know what their prices are for custom patterns, but I don't recall there being a price difference if you wanted one of their grinds on different lobe-centers.

Of course, VW Paradise, Shawn Geers, and Heads Up Performance can all provide you a roller cam...but I don't know what options they have for anything remotely streetable.

Torch · Post by **Torch** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 8:43 am

Thank you for info! I think I will try to do it. Where are the lifters from? What about lifter bores, what needs to be done? I'm from Europe so cannot ship the case over to Rocky, I have to use local machine shop.

Stripped66 · Post by **Stripped66** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 10:10 am

Torch wrote:Thank you for info! I think I will try to do it. Where are the lifters from? What about lifter bores, what needs to be done? I'm from Europe so cannot ship the case over to Rocky, I have to use local machine shop.

You can arguably use whatever lifters you choose. I would inquire as to what solution your machine shop can create, not try to adapt somebody else's design. I'm not trying to be a prick, but you're not going to get much info on how Rocky does his lifter set-up. It's not a difficult process, but if you're not familiar with the myriad of roller lifter designs, from stock OEM to SBC2 race set-ups, then become familiar...you'll figure out a solution from there.

Post by **Piledriver** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 12:43 pm

Word of caution...

Jake Raby has spent many months>a year of development time and tens of thousands of dollars trying to develop roller lifters in a production/street-reliable roller lifter process for his turn key engines.

(The T4 case is made from the same material as the Wasser case)

From what can be determined from his posts, the lifter bore material and machining tolerances are critical/troublesome for long term reliability, and he has gone through several iterations of special machining fixtures to make absolutely sure the lifter bores are square and true to the cam centerline... and likely every conceivable lifter bore material.

Last I heard, he still wasn't happy.

I STRONGLY suggest you take it to someone who installs roller lifters regularly on ACVW engines, absolutely NOT a local machine shop.

Stripped66 · Post by **Stripped66** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:04 pm

Piledriver wrote: I STRONGLY suggest you take it to someone who installs roller lifters regularly on ACVW engines, absolutely NOT a local machine shop.

Well, unless Jake is going to do your roller conversion, you're gonna be in for a rude awakening.

Post by **Piledriver** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 3:58 pm

Stripped66 wrote:
Piledriver wrote: I STRONGLY suggest you take it to someone who installs roller lifters regularly on ACVW engines, absolutely NOT a local machine shop.
Well, unless Jake is going to do your roller conversion, you're gonna be in for a rude awakening.

Sadly Jake is only offering it on turn-keys.

nsracing · Post by **nsracing** » Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:36 am

You can use at minimum Alum 6061 T6 or Alum/Bronze 954 if you have more exotic cash. Just pay attention to the press fit about about 0.001 -0.0015 inch. Pay attention to the finish on the cuts. This will be dictated by the quality of the toolbits used. New carbides are very good choices but if you feel like spending...diamonds. Diamond on aluminum is something to behold. PRETTY!

It is not hard to machine bushings for crying out loud. Here is a little trick you can follow for this process. Do not machine the water jackets until you are done with the rebushing process. Use the end of the jacket to stand the case on the milling table. I can tell you that it is very accurate...in-line with the cam bore and lifters.

Also, the roller lifters that are used come in either keyed styles...BB or square keys. Or if you want more work, the other dogbone syles.

Some people actually think they are the only ones who can use Bridgeport milling machines.

Good luck.