Dynamat Alternative?

[doc]

As requested.

FatMat1.jpg

FatMat2.jpg

More, if I can find them.

doc

[harryset]

Nice Doc. Did you put padding up in the overhead as well? If you did, did you have to adjust the length of the bows any. It seems as though they are overly long with the stock length.

[harryset]

Reply back from Second Skin says that if you get it stuck on like you should have done anyway, there is no problems putting it in the overhead. I got a couple of other replies that stated they have had theirs installed in the overhead for 5 years or more.

[doc]

The headliner is not in yet, so haven't faced that issue.

doc

[Lew]

Doc,

From your recent picture of the Fatmat in the overhead, looks like you ran it from front to back......I am thinking it would be easier for me to install it from side to side should I decide to do it. Your thoughts on running it the way you did. Any particular reason for running it front to back......maybe the curve in the top running it side to side would cause seams to not match up and wrinkles would occur. That's what I have to avoid since I am installing fabric overhead.

[Fahrfrumnuvw]

Doc,
In photo FatMat2.jpg what have you used on the floor in back, it appears like a spray on foam or something. I've just begun striping the interior out of my car, I'm trying to get rid of all the glue / tar, WD40 seems to be working well, I'll scrap off the surface rust and treat with POR-15, then apply FatMat or similar.
Did you re-use the gray fabric padding that was between the headliner and metal, or do something else?

When stripping my car, I noticed that there is insulation material pressed in a seam below the rear window, it seems to be pressed deep into the crevice, do you remove this or leave as is?

Thanks,Wayne

[Lew]

Wayne, do not remove the sprayed in foam.....you can smooth it down to be flush with the metal, but don't do anything other than that.

Rear firewall.JPG

[Fahrfrumnuvw]

Doc,

In your photo, I can see that the seam just under the window where the rear upright (back of cargo area) meets the small curved section under the window appears to have spray in foam. In my '69 that seam has a fiber type gray material, I thought it to be the same as what is under the headliner. I can pull it out, but for the moment left it as is. I don't think the car has been apart before.

rear shelf.JPG

I think you can see the material in this photo, otherwise I'll have to take another.

Wayne

[doc]

Lew - Whether side to side or front to back, I can't think of a difference. I did front to back only because it used the biggest whole pieces. It was easy to do. Bubbles aren't a big problem to start and any you get can be easily worked out or cut a small slit in the bubble, press down and trim overlap. Almost perfect and really easy, even for me. If you are going to install a fabric liner directly to the roof, I guess you will have to worry about the seams. Maybe you could go over the seams (or the whole install) with some kind of "silicon type" goo and smooth everything down to baby bottom? Sounds hard. How about the original bow system?

Wayne - I think the stuff you are seeing on rear package tray area is the original vw material glued down in 1957. I left it. Although kinda hard and crusty, it's glued down tight and I think will provide all the sound deadening and rattle resistance necessary. If it had been really ratty, I would have FatMated the area. Carpet will go atop this whole area adding another insulation barrier from the mighty exhaust note of the 36hp in the rear. Can't have too much overkill.

Shoved down the rear pillars in the original cars are little pillows. They insulate that hole, I guess, that runs down into the engine compartment. They should probably be replaced with appropriate material (won't rust, retain water, etc.). There have been other threads on this subject They probably have better explanation and advice.

Fahr - Almost all the seams where metal meets metal have factory seam sealer. Leave it. Fix it with new seam sealer if it is damaged. This stuff is pretty sturdy even after decades. Best left alone unless something is wrong.

As a last comment, let me say that FatMating the car (roof, floors, firewall, doors, rear panels) was easy. It took several hours of cutting and pasting and some time to make sure everything was pretty clean before I started. Bubbles are easily handled, as noted above, unless you are looking for perfect finish. From what I've read, I and most of the rest of us are overkilling the insulation as just 25% coverage maximizes most of the sound and rattle stuff. But it looks good and gives satisfaction when you complete the job. The car will look different.

doc

[Lew]

Lew - Whether side to side or front to back, I can't think of a difference. I did front to back only because it used the biggest whole pieces. It was easy to do. Bubbles aren't a big problem to start and any you get can be easily worked out or cut a small slit in the bubble, press down and trim overlap. Almost perfect and really easy, even for me. If you are going to install a fabric liner directly to the roof, I guess you will have to worry about the seams. Maybe you could go over the seams (or the whole install) with some kind of "silicon type" goo and smooth everything down to baby bottom? Sounds hard. How about the original bow system?



doc

Doc, I plan on making a test using a scrap piece of Fatmat with a small piece of my fabric to see how well it looks and sticks first. There really should be some insulation in the overhead. Ah, the hour of decision will come later. As for hiding the one seam, I don't think I will have a problem. I plan on running my 36" fabric from side to side using a contact cement sprayed on the fabric. As for the hiding the one seam, I plan on using a Teak, or Mahogany batten 1" or so wide that will cover the seam. Several battens will be placed evenly just to balance the look. Make sense!

[doc]

The proof is in the gluing!! Pics, please, when you do it.

doc

[volksbugly]

I used quick roof 16$ a roll

http://www.homedepot.com/buy/building-m ... 22397.html

1 roll did the back luggage area.

I've had it on for about 3 weeks now loving it. made my car so quiet.
next is to get some carpet padding

[hugging corners]

Hello all
I need to give a bump to this tread with new solution.
for the past few months i was tinkering about less orthodox noise suppressant
This is a very alternative approach which gave me A + results.
its called 9235 do your search
5 gallons of this product costs over 500 dollars-yes
...but with a little bit of smarts and connections you can get it for free.
This product is becoming industry standard in residential and commercial construction
In NYC building dept REQUIRE it- no substitutes.

it does not off gases- it's environment friendly
it is primary used as a water retention membrane in shower pans-instead of lead (but it says that it has sound isolation)
it has antimicrobial properties,
...and as far that i am concerned it is a superior alternative

In specifications you will see that it is applier to concrete, wood, plaster (gypsum boards) and to steel reinforced
mortals.
Also it says that it could be used on painter surfaces with "restrictions" what they mean is house oil painted walls
-which in bathrooms are filled with scum, oil and grease.


Now how i did it:
tested it first on rusto primed metal. After cure it peeled together with primer (as a rubber based product good adhesion- so that's a GO)

layer of rusto primer- dry time
2 layers of rusto pro enamel (rustolenuim paint job)- complete dry time
(now the step i missed because i forgot where i put the can of super 77, but i would just glaze the dried paint with it and let dry- 3 mins before appling membrane- any vinyl or rubber adhesive will stick to it so that way you prime the surface.)
APPLICATION
I have used HVLP gun with #2 tip for primers. This substance works like butter- it stays in any thickness you apply.
I have dropped about 3 quarts to a gallod within 1.5H (3 coats ) but should have waited for each to dry a bit
HVLP gun does additional magic- since it applies paint low pressure but high volume with HEAT of vacuum motor- it semi atomized this liquid making it even thicker as it sprays.

RESULTS:
Right away after 1 layer everywhere , roof inside door, in/out door panels- when door was shut i was like wow, or more like WOW..so did another 2
... bare chassis no interior and it closes doors with no clunk- i mean none:))))

Few more things- when applied it looks it has a little more loose consistency to rubberized sound deadening sold 4-10 dollars a can. (3M, rusto product), but it has the same weird incandescent glow to it as it sets and it darkens up same spectrum- remember paints usually lighten.
dried beefs up in density and flattes
and lastly i know that this product is MAD expensive and i had to pay for it i do it "right"

...but construction business has a excess of this product just ask you tile laying buddy or building supervisor- they can hook you up!

good luck and ask q's? if any:)

[doc]

Interesting solution!

doc

[Steve Arndt]

The 10 sq ft pack of Fat Mat off ebay worked so well in my baja that I just bought a 50 sq ft roll to do more on the baja, and my vanagon. This stuff works great, and is killer sticky. When I used dynamat (the real stuff) 10 years ago it required a heat gun and lots of rolling. The newer Fat Mat sticks with a simple roll job.

The 50 sq feet cost under 70$ shipped on ebay. The 10 sq ft pack from the same seller was almost 35 shipped. Economies of scale. 50 ft is probably enough to do a light job on three beetles, or a very thou thorough job on two. .