Case split, just get get it fully apart, what am I missing?

[The Newf]

Pistons have to go...they are not your issue now,but they won't pass through the cylinder bores in the case when you get that far

[lakedawgs]

That has to be my problem. What a dumbass move.
Need to go back and see how I missed that in the manual.
Thanks!

[Piledriver]

Yes, barrels are removed, not pistons. Just about everything is off the motor; breather, fuel pump, distributor, etc. Crank and cam are now loose. I am going to get it back on my bench tonight and go over the studs to make sure nothing is hold me up.

I may be misunderstanding you, but the pistons must come off first.

RE the gold coating:
The fellow on TOS says its a "chemical coating" and offers the service, so it's probably alodizing or similar.
Never occurred to me to do a whole block.

[Chip Birks]

Yes, barrels are removed, not pistons. Just about everything is off the motor; breather, fuel pump, distributor, etc. Crank and cam are now loose. I am going to get it back on my bench tonight and go over the studs to make sure nothing is hold me up.

This is absolutely your problem!

[lakedawgs]

OK, did not remove the pistons, dumbass move for sure.
Case is apart, time to start cleaning parts and evaluating.

[Marc]

Since it sounds like you probably jumbled the lifters the option to reuse them has been removed. If the cam is still good, new (or reground) lifters should be used with it.

Question: is it the original T0 case? These are essentially the same as the F0 and H0 used in `66/`67 Beetles (other than the oil fill/dipstick arrangement) which means small oil passages and single relief, 10mm head studs without inserts or sunken stud modification. Not a good choice for a performance project but could possibly be buildable as a stocker (they weren't cursed with the "cottage-cheese" alloy used in `68/`69).
If it's the original crank it won't have cross-drilled rod journals (arguably better in a small-passage case); the change from gasket to O-ring where the flywheel meets the crank came in mid`66 so it could be either style. The O-ring 109-tooth 'wheel for 200mm clutch is a pretty rare item, found only in late`66 Type II and III (US-market). Inspect the starter teeth closely, there'll be two areas worn more than the rest - you'll want to put it back on 90° displaced from where it is now.

[lakedawgs]

It is a T0 case from Jan. '66. Have been very careful marking parts and keeping things in order during the tear down process, but the lifter did get mixed up. Need to clean all parts and then decide what needs to get reworked or replaced.
Motor will definitely stay in stockish condition. Looking for longevity not power. Just trying to educate myself on the smartest way to do that.

[Marc]

It is a T0 case from Jan. '66...

Would've left the factory with the gasket-style crank & flywheel, then. The change to O-ring style came a few months later, starting with T0 210167.

Is it your intention to leave the car 6V or do you plan to convert it to 12V? That's a little more ambitious for a Type III since you need to acquire a different fan housing that accepts the larger-diameter 12V generator (or graft in a small 12V alternator - there's one from a Japanese forklift that can be used).

This thread has some pics which show the difference between the early and late parts (note that it's physically possible to put an early flywheel on a late crank, but it takes machinework to do the reverse):
http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... 8&t=143645

An oft-overlooked detail is that the inside diameter of the endplay shims was reduced when the O-ring crank was adopted. If you run early shims on a late crank they will sling around like hula-hoops and slice right through the snout of the crank until they hit the dowel pins....so don't do that

[lakedawgs]

Car is 6v except, previous owner converted to 12v starter. Car has two batteries. Still has 6v generator. There is some type of after market voltage converter under dash. Car started fine before teardown, but it is a pretty junky looking setup. Besides that and newer dual carbs, motor is stock.
I would like, at this point, to keep the 6v.

[Marc]

A 12V starter has a smaller pinion gear & shaft (because the 130-tooth 12V flywheel is ~⅛" larger in diameter). You can put it into a 6V transaxle by using a special thick-walled adapter bushing, but if you run it against a 109-tooth flywheel it'll barely make contact, sound like hell, and maybe even hang up. To put a 130-tooth 'wheel into a 6V bellhousing it needs to be clearanced at five points (the bumps around the mount bolts and the bushing have to be taken down slightly - it's typically done by hand and fairly obvious). And if you still have a gasket-style crank, an O-ring style 'wheel would need some machining before it would fit.

So-o-o-o, I doubt that the P.O. actually put in a 12V starter. Count the flywheel teeth, if there are 109 the starter is 6V. A 6V starter will last a long time on 12V provided it's never cranked for an extended period, but the life of the non-hardened flywheel teeth is shortened. A 12V solenoid can be fitted to a 6V starter to lessen the engagement speed...look closely at the starter housing and the solenoid, their voltage rating should be stamped in.

Are both batteries 6V or is one 12V and being charged via a step-up converter?
There does exist a specialized relay that will keep two 6V batteries in parallel so they can both be charged by the 6V generator, then switch them to series when cranking.
One could also leave everything 6V and run 2 6V batteries in parallel, to increase the available cranking amps.
Are there any 12V accessories (like the radio)?

[lakedawgs]

Flywheel is 109 tooth. Car has a 6V battery and a 12V battery

Did a bit of looking. There is a 'Voltage inverter' under the dash. It's label says it converts 6V DC to 12V DC. The ignition switch turns but will not fire the motor. A pushbutton installed on the dash. Turn the key to the on position, push the button, start the car. A wire runs from the voltage inverter to the pushbutton and then, directly to the starter (straight to the motor, over the seats, classy wiring). I have not looked in to this setup much since I recently go the car and truly, do not understand the logic behind it.

[Marc]

You've got an independent 12V system (the 12V battery and the pushbutton) for the (almost certainly 6V) starter, and the 12V battery is being kept charged by the 6-to-12V converter. Odds are that the output voltage of the converter isn't quite high enough to put a full charge into the 12V battery, which will shorten its life, but I've seen Mickey-Mouse setups like this work for years.
If you have a healthy 6V battery you probably don't have to go this extreme - the more common "fix" for 6V no-crank woes is to add a relay to the solenoid circuit so that the stock wiring from the battery to the ignition switch and back doesn't need to carry the full solenoid current. The flywheel teeth will last longer that way too
...and you can still use the converter (and perhaps even the 12V battery, too) should you decide to add a 12V radio/CD player/GPS/etc.

[lakedawgs]

Why did he do this? Does the 6V stock setup have a hard time starting sometimes?
Not sure if I will keep this setup in the long run. Will for sure rewire whether I keep it or not. Looks like it was done after about 8 beers!
Don't like the idea that it may not be good for longevity.
But do like the idea of having 12V available.

[Marc]

Why did he do this? Does the 6V stock setup have a hard time starting sometimes?...

Oh, yeah. As the electrical system ages and resistance increases, it's commonplace for there to be insufficient current available to pull in the starter solenoid. Even 12V cars are susceptible to the syndrome, although it's much less common with them. As I alluded to above, simply adding a "booster" relay to the solenoid circuit is an effective solution, and the way that most folks deal with the problem. The setup your P.O. put in obviously will work, and offers much-increased cranking speed in the bargain, it's just not very elegant.

If you were to put everything back to stock and add the booster relay you could still have 12V available for a modern radio by keeping the 12V battery and the converter to keep it charged (well, probably about 75% charged at best, the converter output voltage isn't likely to be high enough to bring it to 100%).

The negative post of the 12V battery can have its own stout ground cable; then in an emergency you could always flip up the seat and use a jumper cable to manually apply 12V to the system while cranking. To keep from blowing out lamps or the 6V battery & accessories, turn everything off and connect a cable to the positive post of the 6V battery. Only make the connection to the positive post of the 12V battery after you've turned the key to the start position, and remove it before you release the key. That sequence will ensure that any sparks generated won't be in the vicinity of the (ostensibly dead) 6V battery which will produce explosive hydrogen gas while 12V is applied to it.

This would be a perfect time to go ahead and do a proper 12V conversion but it sounds like you'd rather not tackle too much of a challenge at this point. Leave `er 6V and keep an eye out for swapmeet deals on things like the 12V wiper motor, generator, & fan housing that you'll need to do the conversion when you do get around to it.

[lakedawgs]

Good stuff, thanks!
Electrical is down the road on this project.
Need to get back to tacking rust and cleaning motor parts.
Thanks much!!