ShopTalk Forums | Aircooled VW Tech & Restoration Help

The 924/944 torsion cover and the inner on the T1 torsion tube are IIRC the cone type, and the holes are reasonably uniform in size, perhaps even same diameter.

Some delrin/torlon or even rubber bushes bored out to take the bronze/steel inserts would probably work.
You would have a tapered plastic bushing on both sides, VW inner, 924/944 outer.
(The torsion tube/ends etc are not identical but are easily adapted to T1 as you know)

Greased Delrin itself might work fine with just a steel inner "race" to ensure its round.
If memory serves the 944 lacks an inner bushing so the outer is 2x the width.
(have a rear tube/caps out back I'm referring to, but my memory may be failing)

I highly suspect its doable, and may even exist as something you can buy.

Post away BBB it's all good stuff, guessing the bottom of your car is all plated flat? Cool!

Steve Arndt wrote:http://www.elephantracing.com/project/9 ... atediy.htm

Cool but the VW inner bush is different ?(I think, haven't had one apart in years tho)
Very close to "there".
If vw inner bushing is same that's the solution.

924/944 stuff is same as IRS beetle when talking about the spring arm bushings. the cover for the 924/944 is different in that it has an additional mount built in IIRC.
The 924/944 diagonal arm uses a different ID bushing, but OD remains the same.
The 924/944 diagonal arm/spring plate interface has a different bolt pattern to allow for the camber (and some height) adjustment.

The alloy 944 arms are a different bolt pattern but the early steel arms and matching spring plate have the same pattern as irs bug. As well as the ride height adjustment, the 944 spring plate has a larger hole for the trailing arm bolt nearest the torsion bar (18mm instead of 12mm) . This is for an offset bolt that adjusts the camber. You can fit the 944 special bolt (which is also the sway bar link connection point) by hand filing the front bolt hole in a bug spring plate to the larger size.
Did that job today. Would have rather fitted the 944 spring plates for easy corner weighting but I haven't sourced a pair yet so the bug part will do for now.

The special bolt:



M12x1.5 for securing the spring plate to trailing arm (with step that fits in the enlarged spring plate hole) and M10 for the sway bar drop link.

helowrench wrote:924/944 stuff is same as IRS beetle when talking about the spring arm bushings. the cover for the 924/944 is different in that it has an additional mount built in IIRC.
The 924/944 diagonal arm uses a different ID bushing, but OD remains the same.
The 924/944 diagonal arm/spring plate interface has a different bolt pattern to allow for the camber (and some height) adjustment.

Are you sure about the bushings being the same?
I know the early arms/spring plate setup fits a T1/T3 with the VW bushings, but IIRC the Porsche bushings OD and shape differ, at least the inner springplate. IIRC VW inner is tapered and has locating knobs, but again from memory.

Googleing and comparing the pics they look ~similar, except the 944 bits lack the anti-rotation "knobs" on the T1 inner bushing (as the Porsche factory glued them on the spring plate), and the 944 outer is wider, but using a cut down 944 outer cover the 944 bits may very well be a bolt-in.

Only one way to be absolutely certain...

Well, two, as you could probably simply ask Elephant racing for dimensions and if anyone else had done it...
It might well be worth rigging up a boring bar for the VW torsion tube bushing hole if needed.

All things considered it might be well worth a phone call.
I might consider upgrading these myself.

I have fitted the elephant racing bushes on my IRS ghia. I used the cut down 924/944 alloy housing for the outer and for the inner I sawed out the middle of a red VW urethane knobby bush with a hole saw to take the elephant racing bush.
As you know the red urethane bushes are a poor fit so shape the outside of it first to fit your torsion housing using files and sanders etc. before you cut the centre out with the hole saw. I clamped the knobby bush between two boards to do the hole sawing in a drill press. Go slow, don't let it get hot

I have a 944 torsion housing, the caps/covers, etc. I can check some extra urethane T1 bushings I have to make sure they fit the inner torsion tube area of the 944 housing.

The outer bushings are double sized and specific to the 944 torsion cover.

Steve Arndt wrote:I have a 944 torsion housing, the caps/covers, etc. I can check some extra urethane T1 bushings I have to make sure they fit the inner torsion tube area of the 944 housing.

The outer bushings are double sized and specific to the 944 torsion cover.

The 944 inner bushing fit vs a T1 torsion seems to be the question.
Sounds like its smaller od, but it would probably be trivial to have a plastic or metal spacer made to fill the gap.

Mine were made from aftermarket T1bushes, 'twas a while back in the mists now, but I seem to remember my engineer turned of a knobby inner bush and made the outer one like a top hat with a rim up against the spring plate, this may be part of my sticksion problem, he has passed now, bless him, damn good engineer and had a hand in all my builds and engine machining.

As an in-between bushing alternative, SACO has a line of injection molded delrin rear bushings for a variety of T1 arm/housing combos. Sold by many places, and at about the same price as the urethanes.

Pacific customs seems to sell all the sizes, they also have the matching IRS inner pivot bush set.
They sell as pairs of inners and pairs of outer spring plate bushes in several sizes, I'm still trying to figure out what arms I'm going to end up running or I would have ordered them already.

Delrin is relatively hard/tough but self lubricating and very low friction, but will work with grease.
For the price they are probably unbeatable, and are a bolt-in.

search for "saco94 delrin" at http://www.pacificcustoms.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?

Had my spring plates off today, and tried the VW outer bushing to the 944 torsion:
They T1 variety are actually larger OD, (or the urethanes are just oversize) so you could get 2 sets of the outer SACO delrin bushes for ~$32, and turn them down to fit the 944 torsion, stuff machines great.
The delrin bits may just drop in.

The outers are a little shorter than the 944 aluminum cap/mount recess, but it would be trivial to make a ~1/2" spacer, which could also carry a dust seal.
That would probably make for an ~ideal setup.

As you have an IRS VW of course just order the delrin 1-7/8" ID outer and inner knobby and bolt them in, they supposedly actually fit right. (Still don't know if the ones I ordered Monday have shipped, last time I try and buy direct from SACO)

Polish the spring plate bits that make contact with the bushings. You can use moly CV grease too, its lubeable unlike say Teflon bushings.

The black graphite/moly impregnated Prothane units I installed 80K miles ago were still covered with gooey silicone grease with no apparent wear.
(Energy Suspensions VW parts are Prothane bits, as is most of their import stuff, they even advertise it as such)