New Design Type 4 Heads

This is the place to discuss, or get help with any of your Type 4 questions.
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low down bugger
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Post by low down bugger »

L.A.R.D wrote:This project would move faster if we had a genuine list of people who would buy these heads. The typ1 style exhaust port head could be available at very short notice.
I'm more than interested in a set or two. I've been waiting for a pair of twin spark EP heads for what seems like forever, getting pretty sick of hearing that they will be ready in six months (again) :evil: .
It's encouraging to see that someone is taking the initiative to actually make decent aftermarket heads for the type 4 and judging by the reliabilty of the other manufacturers, there should be no real competition :wink:
L.A.R.D
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Post by L.A.R.D »

Here you go guys typ1 all done. typ4 here we come


Image
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Clatter
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Post by Clatter »

typ1 all done. typ4 here we come
I have that problem all the time, too.
That beetle junk keeps getting in the way of the good motors. :wink:

Put me down for a set of these heads.
I'd buy a pair tomorrow if i could....
Speedier than a Fasting Bullet!

Beginners' how-to Type 4 build thread ---> http://shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=145853
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dstar5000
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Post by dstar5000 »

I believe L.A.R.D's post refers to the T1 Throttle bodies and intake
setup...NOT the T1 heads.....
:-)

Don
‎"Let me say it as simply as I can: transparency and the rule of law will be the touchstones
of this presidency,".. Barack Obama January 21, 2009, 30 minutes before he signed the law
sealing all his personal information....
L.A.R.D
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Post by L.A.R.D »

Clatter wrote:
typ1 all done. typ4 here we come
I have that problem all the time, too.
That beetle junk keeps getting in the way of the good motors. :wink:

Put me down for a set of these heads.
I'd buy a pair tomorrow if i could....
Dont worry its coming.
type3
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Post by type3 »

L.A.R.D wrote:Here you go guys typ1 all done. typ4 here we come


Image
That's pretty sweet!
L.A.R.D
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Post by L.A.R.D »

Another new product out for all you typ4 boys, our new stainless 4 into 1 with stainless turbo muffler.........
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Image
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typ4
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Post by typ4 »

MAke one like a trimill upright for a buggy and they will sell like crazy.
2840 type4, turboed and injected with my GM conversion. runs great and still needs fine tuning.
MRRAGPICKER
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Post by MRRAGPICKER »

What is the cost of that header., plus the shipping to USA?
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Piledriver
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Post by Piledriver »

Typ4 has a point...I hate to link this, but you might consider making one similar to this.... that you cannot apparently buy...
(upright/offroad type for buggies/bajas)

http://www.bergmannvw.net/index_original.htm

(Purple T4 motor top left---nice layout)
Addendum to Newtons first law:
zero vehicles on jackstands, square gets a fresh 090 and 1911, cabby gets a blower.
EZ3.6 Vanagon after that.(mounted, needs everything finished) then Creamsicle.
L.A.R.D
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Post by L.A.R.D »

MRRAGPICKER wrote:What is the cost of that header., plus the shipping to USA?
$700 inc of shipping, for header and muffler, why not try and do a group buy, iam sure the price would come down . muffler is dyno proven to over 250bhp, proper glass cloth rapped, doesnt blow out after a year like some other mufflers.
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Piledriver
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Post by Piledriver »

Nice!
Addendum to Newtons first law:
zero vehicles on jackstands, square gets a fresh 090 and 1911, cabby gets a blower.
EZ3.6 Vanagon after that.(mounted, needs everything finished) then Creamsicle.
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Paul H
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Post by Paul H »

Back to the heads
Has any got the any measurements of where the extra studs go on a 6 stud conversion? I might be able to put some material in where needed
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Type 4 Unleashed
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Post by Type 4 Unleashed »

Paul H wrote:Back to the heads
Has any got the any measurements of where the extra studs go on a 6 stud conversion? I might be able to put some material in where needed
If material was to be added, I think the top & bottom of the cyl deck area would be the place. How much is the question ?

When you bore a head from the 94mm bore to the 103mm bore, the sealing area for the cyl has now been moved around .350"-9mm to probably close to the edge of the deck casting, which is where the cooling fins start. On the bottom if material was added to the deck, that would shorten the length of the cooling fins, because you couldn't extend the cooling fins, because the push rod tubes are in the way. The top side you could extend the cooling fins a bit.

But a problem could exist, if the heads couldn't get enough cooling, the extra material added could tend to get heat soaked.

I haven't read this post in a while and don't remember if an additional cooling fin has been suggested ?

Here's the link to the guy that had 6 studs added, to his case & heads. Could the decks be extended up to or past where the 5th & 6 studs are located ? Even if a person decided not to go 5th & 6th studs, the deck would be stronger and would have less of a tendency to warp, from going to the larger bore's.

Just some ideas.

http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... ight=studs

Here is a picture of a Type 1 Autocraft head, where you can see what looks like the deck casting extends past the stud holes. This is what I was trying to explain.

Image
Richard

EMW

“Have you ever noticed how some people never
have the money to do it right, but can always
find the money to do it twice ?”
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Wally
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Post by Wally »

I think original heads could do with a bit more meat up top anyways, as the top seems to leak first usually. Reason is the location of the spark plug on the top, which 14mm hole make the head more prone to warping between the two top stud mount.
Warping makes the heads leak because of the sealing that is compromised then. On a sidenote: The unequal head stud lengths (tops are shorter, still they leak there first) has obviously no meaning in this. Took me a while to realize that...

You may have noticed on original heads, that the top fin is cast a little thicker there in the middle, probably to reckify just that issue of the weaker top area...
Then we make the heads even weaker by opening them up and/or machining them down for CR reasons..

Another suggestion: look at the '2,6ltr heads' of Klaus on his website where he has made/cast-in extra material and finned that to both create more strength AND retain cooling properties. Imho, thats the direction you always need to think into with designing a better type 4 head.

So, what I am saying is: by all means add more material to the top, whether it is for 5th or 6th studding or for more structural strength. But with the latter you adresses the problem, while extra head studs only needs to be done if you run out of other options imo. Since yu are at the design stadium, I would try to tackle the original problem (head strength related to cooling) first.

In that respect: Adding an extra head fin is a very good idea still, as this also both helps strength AND cooling. I gladly trade in a cast iron fin of the barrel to an extra head-wide aluminium fin on the head.

Also look at the 356 head and how many and how large those fins are, They were only 1600cc/90 horse engines. We run up to 2,7 engines with our heads! :wink:
Really, cooling is everything. Surely you know all this already, so please let it come back into your design as well.
T4T: 2,4ltr Type 4 Turbo engine, 10.58 1/4 mi in a streetlegal 1303

"Mine isn't turbo'd to make a slow engine fast, but to make a fast engine insane" - Chip Birks
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