Holy torque curve Batman!

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Fri May 07, 2004 7:19 pm

Is that flat or what??? Not bad from a 10:1 engine! Its a 2316cc annihilator that will be installed into a dual purpose 914 for street and DE events.

This engine has a new port design that HAM and I have ben working on, the port velocity is amazing and the mixture was awesome! The sucker loved just 20 degrees of advance and thats where it was when it made this power with a little tiny 135 main jet!

As an example the last engine I did like this was much more peaky, and not as torquey, it needed 30 degrees of timing to make this power, and a 145 main jet. The combo was exactly the same except the port shapes and flow.

Once again, we bumped it up and heard it thump! This one goes down in the record books!

BTW, you should hear the throttle response! amazing! Thanks Len for all the hard work on this design!

The key is power right where you use it, thats exactly what this one was able to do!

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri May 07, 2004 8:03 pm

Thanks JAKE AND LEN! I am really looking forward to getting this engine in the car. I have spent the last few months working on the suspension so this should be a blast at the next driving event. It will be nice not to have to wave so many cars by on the straights.

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Fri May 07, 2004 8:11 pm

You'll get them in the turns with a strong power gear in third, and should be able to really use 4th gear well onto the straight..... Max it out in 4th, and hopefully you won't need fifth before you hit the breaking zone. If you have a long straight and need fifth, you'll drop right in the middle of the torque plot and it'll still pull good....

My 2316 in the 914 made more HP than this one by about 5 ponies, BUT did not have curves like this... it was exactly like this one but different port work...

Mines coming back apart soon.. Can't have customers out running me!

MattR · Post by **MattR** » Fri May 07, 2004 8:17 pm

Im just curious, why does the dyno chart start at 3k rpms?

CGRAVITTE · Post by **CGRAVITTE** » Fri May 07, 2004 8:22 pm

I run mostly at V.I.R. near danville virginia. This track is 3.25 miles and has a little bit of everything to challenge you. Lots of different type turns. some long straights and elevation changes that will take your breath. It will be like learning all over again with this POWER!

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Fri May 07, 2004 8:37 pm

Another customer of mine that runs a 2270 races there too... Ya'll can get in a battle.

This was a power run off of advance. I split runs into two different series alot of times..

Plastermaster · Post by **Plastermaster** » Sat May 08, 2004 2:56 pm

Super efficient! Small jetting, high port velocity = better atomization = less unburned fuel. I'm guessing the retarded timing points to better efficiency too. If the ignition does not need to start while the piston is traveling in the wrong direction there is more power there for when it is traveling in the right direction? I understand why advance is needed, but it seems to me from the time the mix is ignited pressure is building. The less advance needed the better. Whataya think? Dont turbos need less advance?, and squishies too?

These 2316s are really tempting. The only thing that concerns me is streetability and longevity. Really I'm not a hard driver 99% of the time, so I'm not too worried about longevity (it's a T4 right?) I want the power, but I want my grandma to be able to drive it with no problem ( after she relearns the exillarator pedal positioning) LOL

Ron

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Sat May 08, 2004 5:46 pm

Plastermaster you are corrrect in all assumptions on this engine! It even uses a flat top piston..

Reliability:
The one in my 914 saw 2 solid weeks of dyo time, then was installed into the car last January... all I have done to it is adjust the valves and rep[air one small exhaust leak. After the dyno I changed the oil but that oil is still in it today.I have put about 8,000 VERY HARD miles on it and blown TWO 901 gearboxes.

Streetability:

Look at that torque. If you saw the lower end pulls you'd see taht its flat from 1500-3000 then levels up and flattens again to what you see now. The engine is so efficient that it idles perfectly clean with 2 degrees of initial advance.

The engine in my car is just like this but not as good! I short shift it in town and as long asI stay off the throtle it drives very tame. The powerband and the way it comes on is just like a 911... Once again mine isn't as good as this one! It made 8 HP more and needed 1000 more revs to do it. This engine is much better- so mine is coming apart and I'll duplicate this combo, but this time with squishies!

Plastermaster · Post by **Plastermaster** » Sun May 09, 2004 8:51 am

I wonder if squish can't be designed into the head as it is in the piston top. Sure the head cant really squish because it is not moving, but its all a matter of directing the mix whether it be the head or the piston top. Chamber design has been worked with for many years but there is probably only so much you can do with it because the shape has to accomodate the valves which are kind of fixed in their position and angle. If there was a way that the valve could lift away from the chamber rather than into it, there would be more flexiblity in chamber design. I'm just speculating with all this, and maybe if the valves were the issue, by now someone would have made valves that were not flat to accomodate whatever head shape was desired.

As far as the chamber design on these heads, I understand if silence is a virtue.

Ron

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Sun May 09, 2004 11:21 am

Nope, they were a standard 2.0 914 chamber with 53cc..

The key is on the intake port on this one for sure.. we did something similar to the intake port on the 2739cc engine I did a while back that made 239 ponies..

findog78 · Post by **findog78** » Sun May 09, 2004 6:23 pm

Does this new design have any similarities to the funnel theory? Big inlet into a tapered port forcing the air through a smaller exit just before it enters the champer? = velocity! It sounds logical, but I havent heard a lot of feedback of people doing it? Just curious.

Ctrout · Post by **Ctrout** » Fri May 14, 2004 3:48 pm

would this engine perform well with an aftermarket fuel injection set-up? What would happen in terms of the curves, torque, HP, and efficiency? The power that this graph shows is EXACTLY what I would like to have in my 914. What kind of mpg does a motor like this get anyway? I was very impressed with a co-worker's Boxster. At 118mph the computer said we were getting 21mpg.

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Fri May 14, 2004 3:57 pm

It should yield atleast 25MPG, as efficient as it runs, maybe more.. IN NORMAL STREET DRIVING.. at over 100 there is no telling.

It would be great for aftermarket EFI that is programmable.

CGRAVITTE · Post by **CGRAVITTE** » Mon May 17, 2004 1:46 pm

JAKE, Just got a chance to open up the crate and check out the engine. Looks GREAT! Your attention to detail is excellent! Could not really see well underneath the engine but saw the oil cooler was on. Will I need to remove this for the external cooler or have you tapped in some where on the block I just didnt see yet? CLIFF

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Tue May 18, 2004 8:58 pm

Glad you like it.

Hope I answered the oiling questions on the phone when we chatted.. If not call me and I can go over it more in detail.