Jake, should I run the thermostat in my 914?

Eddie Brown · Post by **Eddie Brown** » Thu May 27, 2004 3:56 pm

Jake, I'm deliberating if I should run the thermostat/flaps in the 1911 that I took out of my bug for my 914.

A friend of mine runs his 914 without the thermostat, flaps, cylinder tins(lower ones), or pushrod tube protectors. He claims it runs cooler. What's your opinion? I need to make up my mind on the before I put the engine in.

Thanks for your time,

Eddie.

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Thu May 27, 2004 4:05 pm

screw the left side flap over the oil cooler down to keep constant flow, if you are in a warm climate... Then leave the right side flap open all the time. It needs to be in place for air direction.

You definately need the cylinder tins for increased air pressure over the heads and better direction under the cylinders.. I never run the PR tube protectors.... They do make it run hotter/.

Eddie Brown · Post by **Eddie Brown** » Thu May 27, 2004 4:19 pm

Thanks...I will be running the tin under the cylinders. I'll look into securing the flaps as you mentioned. I wasn't convinced with the idea of taking the flaps out completely because of the possiblity of the air flow going straight over the oil cooler.

Thanks man.

Eddie.

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Thu May 27, 2004 4:24 pm

taking the flap on the left side out will direct ZERO air to the oil cooler... Look at the way it works.

Eddie Brown · Post by **Eddie Brown** » Thu May 27, 2004 4:48 pm

Yeah, I don't know squat about thermal dynamics, but it sure seems that the air would flow right over the oil cooler. Do you screw the flap down completely to ensure a proper seal over the cooler?

Thanks,

Eddie.

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Thu May 27, 2004 5:04 pm

DeathBus · Post by **DeathBus** » Thu May 27, 2004 5:55 pm

the ole "thermostat" debate. I have a friend that swears by them in his Type 1. I put one on my rebuilt 2 L type 4 powered Bus and could tell ABSOLUTLY NO DIFFERENCE in how the engine started, performed, (and as he claimed would improve) or heat.

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Thu May 27, 2004 6:17 pm

Nope, never seen a difference in my climate either..

It may help a bone stock engine, but I haven't owned one of those in 15 years!

Eddie Brown · Post by **Eddie Brown** » Thu May 27, 2004 7:37 pm

Done deal!! Thanks for the info as always. I plan on running an oil temp gauge on this motor to see how the Cali conversion compares to the Pancake cooling of the 914 with the same exact motor. I'm sure YOU already know Jake...LOL!!!

Jake, this is my first time putting together all of the peripherals on a 914/Pancake motor. I must admit that it's fun, and interesting how the engineers came up with all of this stuff. Also, I had a bunch of 914 stuff laying around for a long time before even owning a 914. Finally I get to make some sense of it all. It's really cool. Can't wait to get it running!!

Late,

Eddie.

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Thu May 27, 2004 7:49 pm

The thermostat has absoloutely nothing to do with starting in any weather. It simply makes the engine warm up faster in cold weather. It definately works and is"time-able" on FI engines. Other than that, unless installed incorrectly, its not a hindrance either. Weather its usefull...thats an opinion.

Jake, the left flap makes sense to keep screwed flat. When is lifts, its designed to act identically to the spoilers on the wing of an air liner. It causes turbulence underneath.....which acually pulls the air in through the separate "underhang" space where where the flap hangs past the hinge pin into the cooling manifold. many people don't understand from looking at this flap, that even when the thermostat fails....this space...which is the oil coolers dedicated supply...is always open.
The bad thing I have found...is that when the flap does lift...though it actually increases air over the oil cooler....it creates a huge bubble of turbulence over the cylinders on that side.
I am finding like you have found...that fixing that flap into a straight ramp (screwing it down) makes a smoother flow over the cylinders.

And.....trimming the manifold side flap back toward #4 cylinder...leaving tabs for the hing pins, actually increases the opening area for the oil cooler by about 25%. It also does not disturb the airflow for the cylinders.

Some slight re-ducting with a strip of aluminum inside of the fan housing...to limit the volume of the 3/4 side cooling manifold to volume similar to the right (and plugging the alternator cooling hole)....increases the flow speed by about 15-20% also....or so my crude aenemometer tells me. I could only test at about 2k rpm on the rig I played with in the fall.
So....to clarify...do you leave offthe tins under the PR tubes? Or do you replace them with a re-engineered variant? Ray

jloh · Post by **jloh** » Fri May 28, 2004 4:14 am

what about for a 2L bus...same deal? I live in Charlotte....I guess you could call that "warm climate"

do you remove the right side flap?

if i do decide to run it, how are the flaps adjusted relative to the thermostat?

raygreenwood · Post by **raygreenwood** » Fri May 28, 2004 11:20 am

For the thermostat to do what its supposed to do,..which is make warm up faster, both flaps really need to be in there. Of course....if the left flap makes normal (non-warm-up) running, run hotter, then you have a problem. There is no sense in having the thermostats and flaps at all, for warm-up purposes, if only #'s 1 and 2 warm up faster.
What I am doing to the engine I am working on now, is what I listed above......AND I an modifying a spare right hand flap to be put in the identical position on the shaft on the left hand side. So...when the thermostat is closed for cool weather, I have a vertical flap blocking both sides. When the thermo opens, they both fold up flat against the tin just like the right hand side already does. The nicely curved left hand plate will be screwed down and part of the cooling manifold side, down-turn on that flap ....trimmed back. So I will get better flow AND still retain the cool weather benefit of the flap. I will have to spot weld the flap to the shaft in the new position.

Adjusting the flap and thermostat is onlly done one way. Pull the lever all the way towards the bell housing until it stops. This is closed. Look for the "cranked" area of the cross bar over near the distributor...up against the cooling manifold. This is for you to slip a wedge or large screwdriver behind to hold the flap close while you attache the cable taughtly to the lock screw. Then pull the screwdriver/wedge out. The lever should flex forward maybe 5*. Done. Drive it around...warm it up. The lever should move all the way to the stop...toward the cooling manifold/alternator end of the engine if the thermostat is operating properly. Ray

jloh · Post by **jloh** » Fri May 28, 2004 11:30 am

*caveat* *i have no experience with this topic*forgive the dumb ?*

the cable is cut on my van. so its always in the warmed up position, right?

if so, the installation/ajustment procedure is exactly as i envisioned it.

DeathBus · Post by **DeathBus** » Fri May 28, 2004 11:30 am

I tryed to debate this with my friend who swore the engine would never get up to correct operating temp without a Thermostat, but I just gave up. My argument was that it would , but would just take longer.

Ghost Rider · Post by **Ghost Rider** » Fri May 28, 2004 12:50 pm

what are you referring to as a "flap" ? I am lost!

I do not have a t-stat on my engine, infact, none of the 3 engines I've had did... none had any heat tubing either... but what are the flaps?

of every pic I've seen that shows cooling tin.. I'm don't appear to be missing any...

I'm so f'n lost!