LIFTERS! The future looks promising! Maybe even rollers!
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 6:50 am
Okay guys....
The Type IV lifter situation has gotten way out of hand. It is pretty sad when one is afraid to build an engine because of lack of good lifters.
*The ones that didn't use to fail- Fail like crazy.
*They made the faces better and the pushrod cups explode
*The only others that don't go flat weigh 140 grams, but don't last a whole long time due to their OEM stle face.
The only way to cure it is with Ceramics, and they cost 400 bucks a set+ and are hard for us to get from Schubeck. The ceramics are awesome lifters, they are true pieces of art and always will be. I will always try to use them exclusively in my engines, as I have for the last 6 months.
About a year ago I started doing a big search for someone to help us with lifters, and I finally found someone. I have sent them samples and are simply awaiting their price quotes and quantities. The shop that I am talking with does all their own work, and starts from a very high grade steel to make a lifter in excess of 70 Rockwell! That is awesome compared to the 58-60 Rockwell that we have been seeing out of the ones that are considered good. Since they do their own hardening, and manufacturing they test lifters at 7 different stages of production.
The other nice thing is that the way the lifters are produced they are super lightweight. They are probably going to be in the 75-80 gram range, much better than the 140 gram lifters that the factory used, and even better than the lightweight Scat lifters that used to weigh in around 98 grams.
The company primarily does work behind locked doors for high end race applications, and thats how I found them. Their primary business is to keep lifters alive in engines running OVER 1200 pounds CLOSED SPRING TENSION! These engines turn 9,500 RPM for hours straight. The owner of the company tells me that they can keep cams alive and looking near perfect for 4 of these races, then micropolish the lifters and get 4 more races, and they can do that for over a full season on the same cam and lifter set. The engines they primarily use these lifters in run 85,000.00 to build- A failure of a cam can lose someone over a million bucks if it happens at the right race!
The other nice thing is that all their products are designed to be rebuildable! They offer resurfacing of their parts very affordably!
My lifter testing fixture will be done this week, and I am dyning to test all these lifters and processes against each other with different cams, for hours on end and log all the data. The fixture will provide amazing data for different applications, ramp rates, oil types and etc.
The company I'm talking with also holds a patent on DROP IN ROLLER LIFTERS! These are compatible with the Type IV! They also make their own custom Billet roller cams and can make any profile that we want one off!
Stay tuned, all this will be happening very quick and pricing will follow!
So, in short:
These lifters won't go flat. They are super lightweight. They will have the capabilities of different oiling properties to the valvetrain. THEY WILL BE SOLD TESTED! Thats something that no current lifter has going for it- PERIOD!
As for pricing, expect someowhere in the middle ground between the cost of a set of The Old Johns on lifters and the cost of Ceramics- thats my goal.
btw, IF the roller lifters can be made to run in a TYPE IV- WATCH OUT! The power with these engines and my heads will explode, as my valves sit deep enough to allow stupid opening rates and still clear the pistons with no valve reliefs!
The Type IV lifter situation has gotten way out of hand. It is pretty sad when one is afraid to build an engine because of lack of good lifters.
*The ones that didn't use to fail- Fail like crazy.
*They made the faces better and the pushrod cups explode
*The only others that don't go flat weigh 140 grams, but don't last a whole long time due to their OEM stle face.
The only way to cure it is with Ceramics, and they cost 400 bucks a set+ and are hard for us to get from Schubeck. The ceramics are awesome lifters, they are true pieces of art and always will be. I will always try to use them exclusively in my engines, as I have for the last 6 months.
About a year ago I started doing a big search for someone to help us with lifters, and I finally found someone. I have sent them samples and are simply awaiting their price quotes and quantities. The shop that I am talking with does all their own work, and starts from a very high grade steel to make a lifter in excess of 70 Rockwell! That is awesome compared to the 58-60 Rockwell that we have been seeing out of the ones that are considered good. Since they do their own hardening, and manufacturing they test lifters at 7 different stages of production.
The other nice thing is that the way the lifters are produced they are super lightweight. They are probably going to be in the 75-80 gram range, much better than the 140 gram lifters that the factory used, and even better than the lightweight Scat lifters that used to weigh in around 98 grams.
The company primarily does work behind locked doors for high end race applications, and thats how I found them. Their primary business is to keep lifters alive in engines running OVER 1200 pounds CLOSED SPRING TENSION! These engines turn 9,500 RPM for hours straight. The owner of the company tells me that they can keep cams alive and looking near perfect for 4 of these races, then micropolish the lifters and get 4 more races, and they can do that for over a full season on the same cam and lifter set. The engines they primarily use these lifters in run 85,000.00 to build- A failure of a cam can lose someone over a million bucks if it happens at the right race!
The other nice thing is that all their products are designed to be rebuildable! They offer resurfacing of their parts very affordably!
My lifter testing fixture will be done this week, and I am dyning to test all these lifters and processes against each other with different cams, for hours on end and log all the data. The fixture will provide amazing data for different applications, ramp rates, oil types and etc.
The company I'm talking with also holds a patent on DROP IN ROLLER LIFTERS! These are compatible with the Type IV! They also make their own custom Billet roller cams and can make any profile that we want one off!
Stay tuned, all this will be happening very quick and pricing will follow!
So, in short:
These lifters won't go flat. They are super lightweight. They will have the capabilities of different oiling properties to the valvetrain. THEY WILL BE SOLD TESTED! Thats something that no current lifter has going for it- PERIOD!
As for pricing, expect someowhere in the middle ground between the cost of a set of The Old Johns on lifters and the cost of Ceramics- thats my goal.
btw, IF the roller lifters can be made to run in a TYPE IV- WATCH OUT! The power with these engines and my heads will explode, as my valves sit deep enough to allow stupid opening rates and still clear the pistons with no valve reliefs!
Jake,
)?
