Rods for stroker motors

guest. · Post by **guest.** » Tue Jun 22, 2004 9:20 pm

Can a normal rod be used for a stroker motor or do you have to use the inverted style VW rod. I am looking for a rod that I can use with a Honda ITR rod journal in a 2316 without going to something custom.

Wally · Post by **Wally** » Tue Jun 22, 2004 10:33 pm

Hello guest,

What is an 'inverted style VW rod' and what size are the Honda ITR journals?
What would be the advantage of using a Honda journal ?

Thanks,
Walter

guest. · Post by **guest.** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 2:09 am

Look at the standard connecting rod for most other engines. The rod bolts are on the opposite side of the "beam" of the rod from VW style rods. I am not sure if this is to provide clearence for the cam where as other engines have no clearence problems with the cam.

ITR bearings are the journal diameter of the Honda B18C5 Integra Type R. One of the best bearings availible right now. I know a lot of the Cup boys are using the Honda journal because it is lighter, and a slower bearing speeds than the stock 2.0 and it is smaller. The bearings are incredible compared to what is available for our engines.

http://dwolsten.tripod.com/articles/sep93a.html

Wally · Post by **Wally** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 4:39 am

Ah, I understand now. Yes, we do really need the extra clearence from the 'inversed' rod bolt orientation.
Furthermore; our engines have only 3 main bearings (plus one extra for the nose of the crank at the puley side), so there's an overlap of material between the main and rod journal. Any smaller dimension rod bearing does decrease structural integrity of the crank.
For space and strength reasons, we are usually stuck with the chevy 2" rod journal size as a compromise between the two. In that 2" size, also excellent bearings are available, so we have a lot of possibilities

The V-tec engines specs are truly amazing I must admit (I also really like the S2000 engine) , but not really of a usefull direct use to VW 4-cyl. boxer engines I'am afraid.
Then again, everything can be made (fit) if you put enough effort in it.

Best regards,
Walter

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 6:55 am

I am doing an engine now with the ITR rod journals, its a test/experimental engine. I had Carrillo make the rods for me. Is your journal 40mm?

Getting the journal correct on the crank took us 5 cranks to make happen, the radius is VERY important for strength on the chheks of that journal!

Wally · Post by **Wally** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 7:47 am

Let me guess once: is this for the 66mm stroked 1800 cc race-class (production F or s/th?) engine?

With a small stroke of 66mm or so, the overlap/strength issue would be very small and would make sense therefore.

Walter

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 8:25 am

Hmmn, nope... Its going in a 2316 for some hard running.. The production engines are VERY hard on rod bearings and the Honda stuff is super tough.. The Type IV crank is so strong that overlap doesn't really matter until you get above an 80 stroke.

guest. · Post by **guest.** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 9:25 am

I am looking at doing a 2316 or 2270. It would be really nice if I could call up some of the Honda Shops and order a set of Honda connecting rods. That way I cuold use readily available parts but the rod clearence will be an issue. I have an old counterwieghted crank laying around that I want to have welded by DPR and was wondering if I could go that route without having to have custom rods made. If need be I was going to have Moldex do the crank or maybe even Hank the Crank. THey know the Honda journal better than anyone.

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 9:41 am

Its not very easy at all.. I will be selling the cranks once I get it all perfected. DPR has been working with me on this, but it has been a very difficult process, especialy the rod side clearance issues and radius on the cheeks of the journal.

73notch · Post by **73notch** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 10:50 am

just put a honda engine in your vw

but, yeah, honda is an amazing company

dstar · Post by **dstar** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 1:56 pm

For the work/$$$$ & time invested, it isn't necessary.

HD Chevy(not stock!) bearings can handle over 100 HP per cyl.
MUCH more than our cyls can handle....

Of course, if you just want to say you gots sum HONDUH RS (bling bling!)
parts in your VW engine and sound like you are COOL, then GO FER IT!
BUWAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

THere doesn't seem to be any metallurgical or *physical* improvement
over what is already available.

IMHO, you're pizzin in da wind!

Don

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 1:58 pm

SCCA doesn't look up to engine conversions very much....LOl

turboteener. · Post by **turboteener.** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 2:26 pm

Jake did you use a VW style Carillo rod? Why don't you call HTC or MOldex and talk to those guys about the radius and the journal to save some time?

Don,
If the Chevy was the poop hot setup then why does Rick Hendrick Racing come into the Honda dealer in Charlotte and buy $15k worth of bearings for their engines. Yes Honda sunk more engineering dollars into the ITR bearings than VW probably put into the whole T4 program. You may or may not like Honda but they have some innovations that very few other companies have. If you can't afford to design the best, copy the best.

MASSIVE TYPE IV · Post by **MASSIVE TYPE IV** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 2:37 pm

Already called Moldex, they said I was crazy! Pauter said the same!

I did use a VW style carrillo rod, and its working sweet!

Post by **Marc** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 2:39 pm

turboteener. wrote:...If the Chevy was the S**t hot setup then why does Rick Hendrick Racing come into the Honda dealer...

Apples & oranges. What's best to make a particular V8 happy to spin 9800RPM within the limitations of NASCAR's ridiculous rules isn't necessarily the ideal setup for an ACVW. If you have an unlimited budget and can reengineer almost every internal part your options are far greater, too. One "trick" part isn't a silver bullet that will work equally well in anything.